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Hey, Robert here. It's been like two months since I had LASIK and I'm still seeing 2020. All I had to do was go in for a consultation, then go in for a maybe 10 minute procedure and then my eyes have been great ever since. You know, I healed up wonderfully. It was very simple, couldn't have been a better experience. So if you want to explore LASIK plus I can't recommend it enough. They have over 20 years experience in the industry and they performed more than two million treatments right now if you want to try getting LASIK plus you can get $1000 off of your surgery when you're treated in September, that's $500. Of per eye, just visitmylasikoffer.com to schedule your free consultation. Hello, I'm Erica Kelly from the podcast Southern Fried true crime. And if you want to go from podcast fan to podcast host, do what I did and check out spreaker from iheart. I was working in accounting and hating it. Then after just 18 months of podcasting with Spreaker, I was able to quit my day job. Follow your podcasting dreams. Let's breaker handle the hosting, creation, distribution, and monetization of your podcast. Go to spreaker.com. That's spreaker.com. Hey there, it's Ebony Monet, your co-host for the San Diego Zoo's Amazing Wildlife podcast. In this special episode, we're speaking with Doctor Jane Goodall about the fascinating journey that led to her impactful behavioral discoveries on chimpanzees. It wasn't until one of the chimpanzees began to lose his fear of me, but I began to really make discoveries that actually shook the scientific world. Listen to amazing wildlife on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. What's popping my bubble wraps? No, no, that won't. That was another failure. It can't all be, can't all be hit. Sophie, I'm Robert Evans. This is behind the ******** the show where I tell you everything you don't know about the very worst people in all of history. And like every third episode, I pick up a really bad introduction to try out, but we're going to hit a new catch phrase. Yeah, yeah. Thank you. Thank you for your vote of confidence. Sophie. She doesn't believe in me. Nobody does. But you know who does? Believe me is my guest today. Miles Gray. Hello, miles. Man, really great to do a podcast. I got to tell you, you love that. I'm loving it. You know, I'm loving everything about today, so it's great to be here. You don't get a lot of podcasts in your life and kind of cool. Miles, we're talking about Trump University today. What do you know about Trump University? I mean, not. That much. I mean, I know you know the basics. You know the president had a fraudulent university. Yes. And I think like a lot, not all, but many for profit colleges and universities. It's just a big graft. Yeah, it's a big con game. I think most people know that much that, like, he had a for profit university and it was scummier than full sail. Full sail the one for like, like the entertainment industry or something they'll put you're going to be working on video games in a year, buddy. Or yeah, that kind of **** in the custodian at a developer office. Yeah, it's crazy how you'll be certified to clean a server room. It might say something dangerous about our society that one of the most successful and profitable cons of all time involved dozens of different people independently making fake schools to grift people out of money. That might say something really bad about us. Yeah, yeah, but I mean, it's clever, it's clever, it's a smart. It's a great con. Today, we're not going to be talking about a great con. Yeah, but it made money. It's just a straightforward, just ******** university. It's not straightforward. OK, well, that's good. It's just not as good a con as the University of now. About once a week, someone on Twitter will be like you should. When's your Donald Trump episode coming out? And I'm. I'm never going to do a whole episode about just his life because it's been covered too many times. Yeah, just search any other body. Yeah, there's there's a ton of. But I I was always kind of Trump University is one of those things that, like, I knew something shady had gone on. I knew he'd gotten sued and ordered to repay a bunch of money to people who got defrauded. But I didn't really know anything about it. And so I just kind of got interested in, like, reading about Trump University. And so, like, this weekend, I got really high and I couldn't sleep. And I found a book called Trump you inside Trump University, written by a guy named Stephen Gilpin. Now, Stephen Bills himself as essentially the only honest man inside Trump University. And I'm I think he's fudging the truth to some degree, but a lot of what he says sounds credible. He's not, like, totally. He definitely writes himself out of having a role in the bad parts. Right, right. But yeah, he's like Tiffany Trump. He's like, no, where she's like, yeah, it's my dad. But like, I'm like the one who's like, wearing white at the state of the union's talking **** behind his back, trying to save my own Rep because I know this is a bad look. I mean, yeah, all the, like, you know, rumor stuff about her is that, like, she's just hates like, what is what her life has become or at least likes to openly talk **** about her. I could see that being true. That's that's a rough position as a kid. Yeah. I mean, we joke. I feel like you don't even probably know her. Actual name, yeah, he's like in you. No, I mean, she's talked to any given New York Times White House correspondent more than he has Tiffany. Seriously? Maggie haberman? He's like, are you Maggie? He's like, no dad, probably not the New York Times journalist. OK, so, so he is an insider, he's a whistleblower. One of the sources will have for this. He's he. Well, whistleblower is the wrong word. He got paid to write a book about it after the president started running for the. So he's like a four higher whistle player. He's a, he's a. He's a lower echelon of grifter, yeah, right, he's. It's a fair grift. Like, people want to know about this thing. You have the experience, OK, how am I going to call you a bad person for cashing in on it at that point? But you're not. He's not a hero for sure. Like, yeah, he was a foot soldier in this. Yeah, yeah, of course. And he's just capitalizing on his bad deeds. But we always America, baby. Hey, if you want to hire me for your fraudulent university, I can be reached on Twitter at I write. OK. Do you teach, you know, whatever surgery? It's all good. It sounds so dope. Yeah, well, yeah. Yes, teacher just cut open animals. This is my Professor Roberts tight *******. We did surgery on a ******* dead cow with a samurai sword. He was just chopping away. Just stabbed this **** out of it. I don't know. He said it was like a bypass. Now we're all MD's. This class is just 40 days. Oh boy. Yeah, when I get rich, that's my plan. Fake university, and I respect that. I support it. Tell me where to sign. So the story of Trump University starts in 2004 when Donald Trump, Michael Sexton, and some guy named Jonathan formed Trump University, LLC. At this point, the vision was that Trump you would be a long distance web learning solution where busy housewives and people looking to start a second career could take courses in real estate and business management. Michael Sexton, a longtime Trump employee, noted that the company also planned to experiment with live instructional. Programs. Trump's lawyer filed for a patent around the same time, claiming that Trump you would provide, quote, educational services in the nature of conducting online courses in the fields of business and real estate. So, OK, He's he's it's it's supposed to be like an online business, just whatever. It's real estate. It's business. Yeah, it's making money, baby. It's making money, baby. So the first headquarters for Trump University was one of the few buildings Donald Trump actually owns. 72 Tower Trump building and 40 Wall Street in midtown Manhattan. Now the building is an interesting space. It costs per square foot about half the going rate of space in that part of Manhattan. Why would a skyscraper in such an illustrious location be so cheap? Bloomberg.com? That's a little bit of an explanation. Donald Trump took over 40 Wall Street in 1995. Prosecutors have filed criminal charges against at least 29 people conducted to 12 alleged scams tied to the building 9. Other firms have faced serious regulatory claims. Authorities prevailed in most but not all of the cases. So it's a scam city scam, city tower. Donald Trump's strategy with the Trump building seems to be this. Give shady as people an opportunity to rent dirt cheap Wall Street real estate so they can put that address on their documents and pretend to be legitimate companies. Like, how could this be a fake? 40 Wall St, New York, NY oh ****. Oh, you don't believe it? Pull up to the building. It's a real thing. We got an office. It's just big enough for a single desk. It's a single phone on the floor on a milk crate. Wow. Of course, of course. I don't know why I'm always, like, surprised, but that's kind of cool. That's like for the people who like, have those private jets that you can that are on the tarmac and they're like, you know, for 500 bucks you can have a photo shoot in here and pretend that you are wealthy, that you're wealthy. Well, you're still probably wealthy if you're blowing 500 bucks on a photo shoot, but you're not private jet. Well, yeah, but they're also, I I've also seen the kind of person who is so hell bent on, you know, boosting their Instagram visibility that they would go, you know? Well, out of their resources to do something like that. That is the dumbest thing I can think of doing, spending $500.00 to pretend that you have access to a private jet. Sad, I. Yeah, that that's the. It's like renting of, like, * **** extension. Yeah, it's like, for a second. But what good is that you're still the weird ****** **** guy. It's like paying a guy with a giant **** to take sex photos that you then send to or **** **** that you then send to people who haven't asked for them to pretend that you have a *** ****. Even better. Yeah. It's like, it's like, yeah, it's just in a riveros of sad. And then someone who's, you know, drawn by that is going to be like, so can I see it in, like, oh. Umm, I can tell you this jet, though bigger. Now, there's another fun quote from that Bloomberg article quote a cheap way to get a 40 Wall Street address is to grab space on the 28th floor, which is broken up into small offices. The firms listed in the lobby directory for that floor include your trading room, a foreign exchange operation ordered shut by an Australian court in 2012, and the Asian Aim Incubator Co, which Malaysian regulators put on a list of possible scams, stylish in international law, whose founder was banned from practicing law in Virginia, and ERO Capital Group, run by a man convicted of credit card fraud. So wait, what's the incubator scan? I don't know. We're making, we're making money off of. I only had so many time much time policy incubators this week. Yeah, it's it's so it's it's a scam tower and specifically has a scam floor. So yeah, so is everyone. What's on the other floors? Also shady business, legitimate businesses who just got lucky though the cheap space. Yeah, I'm sure there's someone legitimate working out of there, but it it has a reputation. The SEC of being like one of the biggest hosts to fraudulent scams in the country. Yeah, like, your easiest callers are just to go, like, look at new businesses working like, OK, Wall Street. OK, this is probably shady. Yeah. But, you know, that's the kind of thing only experts are going to notice. Joe 6 pack sitting at home in Milwaukee or Pasadena or Phoenix is going to see Wall Street on an address and assume that it's like legit because New York's got the most expensive real estate in the world, you know? Now, Trump University was not the brainchild of Donald Trump. Michael Sexton, who went on to become the Trump. CEO had the idea to license the Trump name to sell for profit education. This new university was announced via a Trump Tower press conference on May 23rd, 2005. Here's Stephen Gilpin offer author of Trump you quote, with Michael Sexton and other top executives by his side. Donald Trump outlined how Trump University would consist of online courses, cd-roms and other learning programs for business professionals. Bloomberg.com reported on the splashy unveiling the Donald launches his own online self-directed learning courses and they differ mightily from the usual fare, wrote Brian Hindo. With business schools around the country running, Donald Trump's reality TV vehicle, The Apprentice, is a teaching tool. Perhaps it was just a matter of time before The Donald cut out the middleman. On May 23rd, the real estate mogul formerly launched Trump University, a foray into the fast growing field of online education. Courses are expected to begin as early as Thursday, May 25th. Yeah, I just love trying to hang your hat on the fact that you have cd-roms. Yeah, that's part of your curriculum. Well, it was 2005. Simpler days. I do Miss cd-roms. I do Miss cd-roms now, almost as soon as that press conference was conferenced, the New York State Department of Education sent a letter to Trump University. They politely pointed out that using the term university was actually a violation of state law because no one involved in the project had bothered to go about getting the kind of accreditation that's actually necessary to call yourself a university and offer classes and training. Turns out you can't just do that. Turns out there's like laws about what a university is. Sexton promised the Department of Education that Trump University would not instruct. Students in New York. He also promised to remove the 40 Wall Street address from the letterhead and promotional material. None of this was done. Sexton, Trump and Company ignored the Department of Education and just plowed ahead with their plan to offer a basically illegal fake school. Wow. Yeah, it's amazing. Ah, the ******* balls. Yeah, man. Yeah. Just that's admirable to be a sociopath. Yeah, it's it seems. It's at least. I don't know. Consistency is impressive. Yeah, certain extent, yeah. I think that's the through line of this whole series. You know? Like every time I'm here, it's just always like the balls, the balls, the balls on these ********. That first mover advantage. Yeah, like nobody expects you to be the guy who's going to do something this ******. So if you do it, there's a good chance no one will stop you, right? Yeah. And that's how it works. That's like, yeah, like if you see someone, you know, eating out of a salad bar, like at a supermarket salad bar, at first you're like, I do that all the time. Yeah. And look, no one's going to say anything to you. Nobody ever says anything. They just, if anything, those speak in hushed tones to each other. And I buy elephant garlic at the at the grocery store. But I go to the the self checkout thing and I make it look like regular garlic, like 250 a garlic look at you monster. Just save these tidbits for another podcast called Life Hacks with Robert Evans. Red Evans, this is what you do. It's all just, it's the best of scams that I've learned from behind the ******** but in a way that any person can do it. Look, you know, there's there's two kinds of scams in this world. There's there's scams that hurt good people and there's scams that hurt giant entities who can't feel pain. Sure. Yeah. And then yeah, sometimes, you know, but unless, like, you know, sometimes the people working at the store, they get in trouble because, you know, the corporations are unforgiving. Sometimes I can find a victim. All my thieving. It's terrible, this empathy that I have. Ah, screw it. I mean, this is the show. Yeah, it's it's like it's like stealing stamps from the post office. You. How do you still stamps from the post office? Oh, a magician never reveals who steals the stamps. I love that. That's your flex. You know how to steal stamps from the post office on my new show, life hacks with Robert Evans stealing from the post office. Oh, boy. OK, so where were we? Where were we? Crimes, yes. So Donald Trump and Mike Sexton and company ignore the Department of Education and just continue to offer an illegal fake school and it's fine. Wow, that just happens. So it might have seemed to a lot of people that Trump University was somewhat legitimate at this point, partly because Sexton actually brought on accredited human beings to design the courses. The chief learning officer was a guy named Roger Shank, a PhD expert in learning science and artificial intelligence. He's the CEO of Socratic Arts, a company that designs curriculums. Several other legitimate educational experts were brought in to design courses. So, you know, you got to think back to 2005 before Donald Trump is the guy. He is when he's on The Apprentice. But, like, he's just like a rich. Guy, it's only been like the first one season at that point. And most, yeah, this is like in the first season. And most people don't know that for profit, universities are a scam, you know? Right, right, right. Like it's just an alternative. So this does look like, OK, well, this is where they hired the right people, but where the capital come from, they just had those people. Donald Trump put in $3 million. Me and I I hadn't said it. Oh, whoops. He funds this. OK, that makes sense. He drops in his $3 million to, like, get this thing off the ground. So they hire people, they put in some resources, and it looks like they're trying to make a legitimate ish, right? Like, within the standards of the right. It's not like they're head of curriculum. Mavis beacon. Yeah. Like what? No. She only teaches typing. 3 online courses were designed at first, each available for $300.00. So it's not like a ridiculous rate, either. These courses offered instruction in real estate marketing and entrepreneurship. Students worked online in groups of 6 to 12 and had the freedom to finish the courses on their own time frame. Here's how Stephen Gilpin describes these early classes. Quote entrepreneurship. Students would be asked to assume the role of a venture capitalist and analyze a business plan. They would then submit their work to classmates for a peer review, of course, would consist of three such assignments. People learn the hard way. Trying to replicate the Kasmer experience isn't particularly effective, said Michael Sexton. Education is worthless without feedback. This this system enables, however many students we have to get live feedback about their work. This is not for somebody who wants to put a sheepskin on a wall and think that is going to meaningfully help their career. So wait, what does that mean? I I think like a like a diploma like, this isn't just like we're related channels call that a sheepskin. I'd never heard that before, but I feel like everyone who works with Donald Trump was born in the 20s, right? It's just weird when diploma was on a sheepskin. But you can also see like, already it's kind of a con because you're having your work graded by like, when you put it that way, it sounds legitimate, but your work is being graded by your fellow students. And because that's cheaper, right? And then they don't give a **** either. Like, that all depends on what those other students are putting in. If I if that was me, I wouldn't read anybody's thing. And I would be like, yeah, it felt a little derivative, felt a little derivative. And that would be my, my feedback for everything because I'm not reading it. I'm not doing the work, not if you're paying 300 bucks to supposedly have anything because I'm swindling. Themselves with my lack of effort. The scam within the scam, yeah, there's always a scam. So at this stage, it's definitely a kind of con, but it's not really much more of a con than other for profit universities, right? Students aren't paying insane prices for these courses, so nobody like, nobody's going to go deep in debt. Paying 300 bucks for three courses for nothing, that's 900 bucks. You know, that sucks to lose, but it's not that bad. Yeah, for information you probably could have got from, like, Googling, like, how do I become a business? I've become a business man, yeah, and compared to, like, Full Sail University like Trump University kind of verged on legitimate, like, it seems like a pretty good deal. It's your beef with full sail, is it that? Are they that egregious with their? I remember as a kid, all the video game magazines I would read, like PC Gamer, would always have ads for full sale, and one of my friends wound up paying them a lot of money because that was his lifelong dream and he didn't know any better. And, like, it's the ******** thing to do. Somebody wants to make video games and you trick them into paying a bunch of money. **** **** is your friend finally working in video games. No, no, no. That never worked out. You know what will work out? These fine products and possibly services that we advertise on our show. Although because it's randomly slotted in, it might be an ad for another podcast and then my products and services line will be nonsense. But I don't know, miles, I I don't know what explanation. I know what else to do. I'm ready. This is the world we live in. Roll the roulette dice. Mint Mobile offers premium wireless starting at just 15 bucks a month. And now for the plot twist. Nope, there isn't one. 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Visit betterhelp.com behind today to get 10% off your first month. That's better helpp.com/behind betterhelp.com/behind. Hey, Robert Evans here. It's been like two months since I got LASIK laser eye surgery and my vision is still 2020. So many things about my daily life has changed. I don't have to worry about putting on a mask and my glasses fogging up and have to take out contacts at night or put them in the day. I don't have to, like, worry all the time when I'm traveling. Like, how many contacts do I have by going swimming at the lake during the summer? Something I like to do, go to the beach or whatever. I don't have to worry about losing a contact or, you know, bringing swimming glasses or something. With me, everything is just easier. And getting it done was easy too. You know, I went in, I had my consultation, they told me I was a good candidate and then I went back in couple of days later about it being about a boom. You know, my eyes were perfect. So LASIK Plus is a leader in laser vision correction in the United States. They have over 20 years in the industry and more than two million treatments performed. If you want to start your LASIK plus journey, you can get $1000 off when treated in September. That's 500 per eye. So visitmylasikoffer.com to schedule your free. Consultation now. We're back. Are we back? We are back in the USSR. Well, that would be nice. If there's one thing I know about the USSR, it's that they loved podcasting. Big fans, yeah, yeah, big fans. The podcast. I think they invented it, probably. That sounds right. They invented the pod, for sure. Oh yeah, because whales are all communists. Vodcasting, vodcasting. Vodcasting. Yes, man. Did you see that documentary? Icarus? Oh yeah. ******* amazing. I love that. Question, doctor. The balls. Saw out of trap door in the wall to swap out urine samples. I mean, you know what? Maybe you do deserve it. I, I I have no problem with athletes doping. Yeah. I mean, honestly, I don't I don't get the big deal. Just let them all ******* dope and let's just let's see who's the first person whose heart explodes. Well, trying to. Exactly. And that's who loses. Yeah. Or just have like a a special version of the Olympics where we do. See look if if you can put the cheat codes on how far can you take this the way I think it should work. So I've done. I have a friend that I will occasionally have drinking contest with and the rule is always. If you can drink the most without vomiting and so we'll try to like, finish like a like a 2 liter keg of beer. So if you finish first, but you drink so fast that you puke it up, you still lose. That's how drugging yourself in a sporting event should work. If you get away from it for X years you were smart enough. You know Lance Armstrong, you know you're four years clear. OK, you get to keep your titles. Huh? That's how I feel, OK. And it should be fine for me to steal garlic from Ralph. I mean, look, you're just you're just upgrading. I'm just not going to pay $3 and a half dollars for elephant garlic. It's ludicrous. OK, look, you know, I can see it in your eyes, man. Yeah, you're not going to pay $3 for that elephant, steal it from the damn farm if I got it. Yeah, yeah. OK, let's get back to this grift that was not kind hearted like my, my elephant garlic. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a healthy grift, I feel. So the first major textbook for this. Out of University was called Trump 101, the way to success. You can still find the book on Amazon.com. That's a little over 200 pages, which seems like a lot to say. Inherit $700 million from your dad. I found a book list review that describes the chapters, so I'm going to read that to mine this might this might teach you enough to start in real estate. Let me get it. This collection of Trump's wisdom, inspiration, and advice is organized around 20 distinctive motivational themes, including don't waste your life on work you don't love. Set the bar high, tough it out. Be persistent. The proof is in the doing. Learn by doing and taking risks. Your gut is your best advisor. Listen to your instincts. Negotiate to win. Use diplomacy. Swim against the tide the comfort zone can pull you under. Wait for the right pitch. Business success is all about patience and timing. And do more. Always do more. Constantly. Try to top yourself. I feel like I understand his tweeting strategy better after leaving. Wow, those are such empty. Like, yeah, phrases do more. Yeah. That's like, all those, like, motivational posters from, like, the 90s. Yeah. Just be like a hot air balloon. Yeah. And be like, never stop outdoing yourself. Negotiate to win higher heights. Yeah. Use diplomacy. And I'm going to guess that that chapter didn't go into much more detail than use diplomacy. Yeah. Yeah. What a guy to get the end of that sentence is use diplomacy if you're a loser, if you're a loser. And next chapter balling out of control. OK. Now, miles, you just did a pretty good Trump. And I know you do a fantastic Australian. Can you do Australian Trump? I know it's a bit like this, so if you're Australian tramp. That might be that might be flying. Speaking of Icarus. Look, another blunt. Yeah. All right. All right, we'll we'll we'll get another blunt in here and promotional material for the book. Donald Trump himself explained to the value of this weighty tome. Another purpose of this book is to introduce you to Trump University, which grew out of my desire to impart the business knowledge accumulated over the years and to find a practical, convenient way to teach success. Trump University doesn't just bear my name. I'm actively involved in it. I participated in this in creating the curricula, and my words, ideas and image have been woven into the courses we provide. I'm deeply and actively involved in Trump University. Because I firmly believe in the power of education and its function as an engine of success. I want to help people. And Simply put, the Trump University students want to be successful. I'm on their side. Wow. That's, uh, again, like, even if for all the amount of words that were in there. Yeah, a lot of them. Yeah. You could really just boil that down to one sentence is this is good and I. And I'm involved. Yeah, this is good and I'm involved. Go to school. That's it. Yeah. All that other ****. That's what's so funny is, like, it reminds me of me when I used to write essays in high school. Yeah. Or like trying to hit that word count. Oh my God. I would ******* have, like, 90 word sentences. Yeah. You know, just to just say, like, Cardinal Richelieu was Louis the 13th greatest advisor or whatever the **** whichever Louis. That was the 14th. It was one of the Louis, you know, not enough kids named Rishi. Do anymore? Yeah. Well, you know. Yeah. It's part of the pacification of this country. I know. Name. If you're out there and you've got a child's. Name it. Yeah. Name it. Ricola. Oh yeah. Those are great moments when you got a sore throat. Branded content. Yeah. Ricola. If you want to sponsor the show, we'll find a baby to name. Oh yeah. Yeah. We can do that for. Change my name to Rico. I think we have that power. OK. At the outset, Trump University students were promised classes that would be taught by actual Business School professors who communicate with students through an online bulletin board. So? You know, like a real online university, there would be regular Q&A sessions where students could ask Mr Trump for advice on their businesses. So this was billed as a practical business training program where students would receive thoughtful and semi direct advice from one of the world's most famous businessmen. In the press release for Trump University, Donald Trump claimed that his whole goal with the project was to give back to the world and create, quote, a legacy as an educator. He even promised to hand any profits from his business over to an unspecified charity. An unspecified charity. Well, it's always gonna be an unspecified charity. Wow. I'm going to start doing that. That's ******* genius. All of the profits from this show are donated to an unspecified chair. Which is me buying survivalist compound in Oregon. Right. That unspecified of hiding. Well, yeah, right, right. Oh my God. What a good way to just just wiggle your way out of any. I know, it's amazing. Did you do some? Did you clean up the house? I did some unspecified. Unspecified cleaning, unspecified things. Specified. Sure. Specified what? Unspecified charity? Yeah. He should make a T-shirt like that. Cops pull you over. Do you have a license? I have an unspecified license. Specified license of sorts. Get the **** out of car. Yeah. Oh, boy. Oh yeah. So I didn't even read the last Trump quote about how this isn't about money. Here's Donald again. If I had a choice of making lots of money or imparting lots of knowledge, I think I'd be as happy to impart knowledge as to make money. Get the **** out. Oh my God. He still doesn't actually say that imparting knowledge is more important. Like, he sets it up that that's how. But then he's like, oh, they're both equal. They're both equal. And, you know, whatever. I like money, but I like money. Now, when they say knowledge is money, knowledge is money, that is what they say with Betsy. The Betsy de Vos is the Secretary of education or money is knowledge, the ability to access knowledge. Yeah, that's probably more. That's probably more accurate. Yeah. Now in 2005, The Apprentice had, as we just discussed, just finished its first season. It was one of the most popular shows on television for reasons I will never understand. In addition to that, the real estate market was in the midst of an outrageous boom cycle that would later give way to the great crash of 2008. So for a year in change. Trump you existed as a semi legit seeming adult education program for people interested in dipping their toes into the booming real estate market, so makes sense. But by 2007 the market was starting to look distinctly less boomy and more *****. As the economy started to shift, so did Trump University. Roger Shank and all the other professional teachers and curriculum designers who'd been hired at the onset of the project were let go. Shank was told that the school had burnt through the three million in funding Donald Trump had pumped into the venture, Shank later told The Daily Beast. Quote. They put a certain amount of money into it, and then the money stopped suddenly. I said, what happened? And they said, well, we just don't have any more money and we need to make money quickly in some other way. That's what you want to hear from a college. Wait, that's what the college told him. They fired him? Like, I'm guessing it's a person at the yeah. But, like, we need money really fast, and it ain't going to be like, you're great at this, but now we got to make more money, so we're going to find some other way to do it in our college. So wait to know what that plan was? Oh, it's going to be fun. It's going to be fun. So Ronald Schenberg was a sales manager at Trump University from late 2006 to 2007. He later recalled this shift in a deposition. And he made one of the numerous lawsuits as a result of this fake college quote. This is schenberg. Around February 2007, the direction of Trump University's business drastically changed to live events and seminars driven by high pressure front end salesman, inexperienced in real estate, making high pressure sales. So these live events were billed as workshops and learning courses, but they were really just excuses to upsell students on more expensive training rather than using curriculum designed by actual experts. In anything Trump, you brought in a guy named Mark Dove Schanberg described him as a guy. To quote essentially owns that front end, high pressure speaker scam world provided speakers, instructors, mentors and salespeople to Trump University, and these people brought with them their own programs, which turned into Trump University programs. I was very uncomfortable with this new direction of business as I believed it to be very unethical. So there were good people involved in the beginning, right? Whatever. They probably don't fully understand the kind of, you know, scam artist that the president is. No, nobody. I mean the 2005. Yeah. Really different time. It's. Yeah, it's The Apprentice guy. Yeah, great. He's popular on TV. Yeah. Maybe check teach people some real stuff. And then so the Mark Dove guy, they said he owns like just sort of like the same people who probably do like timeshare sales, the exact same come here and then ******* lock you in the room. So they switch over to live events and these live events are administrated by people who are billed as teachers. But who are actually, say just closures? Yeah, they're just closes. Exactly. It must have been so fun. Yeah, it it must have been great. They made a lot of money. He's so full of ****. And just go up there with all this confidence. Like, I can't wait for you guys to be flying on your own jets. Look at this Rolex. I'm going to give someone this Rolex by the end of tonight. Because guess what? By the tomorrow morning, I'm going to have enough for three more of these. I don't know if you could see miles, but I just voted for you to be president. Oh my God. I should just. I couldn't stop myself. I'm going to start a new. Con Man podcast or I'm selling people dreams. Yeah, I mean, all podcasts are a con if they're successful. That's true. I mean, people don't even know it's not even a guy named Stalin. Oh yeah, I made that up for this podcast. You. I'm telling you. Alex Jones. Just me in a wig. Alex Jones. My friend Alex Jones. So this is around the time, 2007, that Stephen Gilpin, the author of that book, got hired by the university. He had a lot of experience in real estate and his business had fallen on hard times as the market started to collapse. They hired him initially to be a one man phone line for Trump youth students who had questions about real estate matters. Gilpin recalled in his book being surprised to learn that nobody else involved in the management or operations of Trump University had any kind of background in real estate as a real estate school run by people who had never done real estate. So where do you work? Just for Hilton Trump foundation? It was the Trump foundation. Yeah, Trump. OK, anything else? No, no, no. I've just been bilking people out of money for a while. OK, now, during this whole time, Trump University ads continued to brag in official promotional material that all the instructors at these live events were real estate experts handpicked by Donald Trump. The Attorney General of New York State later disputed this in a filing quote. In fact, respondents lacked substantiation for the claims that their instructors and mentors were successful real estate entrepreneurs. Not a single one was handpicked by Donald Trump. Many came to Trump University from jobs. Having little to do with real estate investments, and some came to Trump University shortly after their real estate investing caused them to go into bankruptcy. Wow. Failed real estate investors. Yeah, people who don't know anything about real estate. And if they do, they've just got bankrupted themselves. Bankrupted themselves and like, well, I guess I'll teach people how to do this. Ohh, it's it's the American Dream Baby. Just keep failing on up. God, this is such a great country. We really, we really nailed a lot, man. Gotta have the balls, you know? That's all if you if you just lie for 70 straight years and you're a tall white guy. Sometimes not, but always. If you're a tall white guy, there's no limit to what you can achieve. Oh no, no, no. You could even one day be the president of the United States. You could be. You could be. That's what I'm going to do after I shift next year and start writing for the daily wire. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because you want to have that, like, you want to have that arc where you're like, Oh no, I used to be a leftist. I used to be all the. Yeah. Yeah, you could. And you could probably primary Trump. Oh yeah. Well, I won't be old. Quite old enough. Yeah, he'll be out of office by that time. Well, we can doctors help primary President Ann Coulter from the right, from the right. Be the Evans Ingram to the Evans Ingram. Jesus Christ. OK, so there's a video produced around this time, 2007, called welcome to Trump University. I want to play this video to you, miles, and I want you, the listener, to hear it, because that way you'll get an idea of how this was sold to prospective clients. Now, I do want to say up front, this is the only audio of Trump we're going to have in the episode. I had to have a little bit of how he presented this, but we all hear him enough, right? Yeah. So this is all going to have to listen to the promo video. Why? At Trump University, we teach success. That's what it's all about. Success. It's going to happen to you. Donald Trump is without question the world's most famous businessman. As a real estate developer, he has reshaped the New York skyline with some of that great cities, most prestigious and elegant building great land. Donald Trump brings his years of experience to the world of business education with a launch of Trump University. If you're going to achieve anything, you have to take action, and action is what Trump University is all about. All part of Trump University. Trump University is about knowledge, about a lot of different things. Above all, it's about how to become successful. It's not enough of that, God what it was. I mean, you know it it was so bad. Yeah, I really feel bad for people who don't have the media savvy to watch something like that. I mean, go, oh, this stinks like **** now. I think some of that is that, you know, we're we're this was 14 years ago. Yeah, but we were all a little less savvy, but hell no. But still, that's bad. ******* the voice over was from like, a bee action movie from the 80s. Yeah, just as Someone Like You who reads stuff into microphones for living. That was really bad voice. But also just like the. The tone of his voice, it was so dated. Yeah. Like, that style of voice was like, that's such, you know, like, yeah. And it was like, Dean Marciano is a, you know, disgraced detective. His family was killed. Like, that's the kind of weird tone it was. And then it was all, like, not even stock video, stock footage with like that. They just animated to move like, Ken Burns effect. And they're like, I guess that's fine. And then Trump University was just a graphic of a door. It wasn't even like. The building. I I I do love that like kind of raving music that kicked on with Donald Trump start. We all started dancing to it a little bit. It was bizarre. I just I've always wondered what it would be like to run into Donald Trump at like a dance club in Berlin. And that's the closest I'm ever going to come to knowing. Yeah. And or he's sitting on the corner of a desk like it looked like he was in that sip in a club action. What did you say? Trump action is what it takes to be successful and Trump University is all about action again. What does that even mean? What does that even the action of giving me your credit card? Sure. Yeah, yeah. OK. So the first Trump University live events took place in Florida in May of 2007. The second one took place in Los Angeles around a month later. That is where you'd want to start a scam. Florida, then LA. Sensible. So far, each of these live events had about 500 attendees. The events were free, but attendees were encouraged to sign up for longer paid workshops. I see that were happening that day. No, no, no. That happened later. OK. So that you'd come. OK. So that was just to be like, Oh yeah, yeah, come, we'll tell you about it. Well, teacher, well, they will teach you about real estate for free, right? And we'll just tell you just enough vague half sentences that you want to learn a little more. The real meat is to take these these longer seminars. Wait till you hear about the cost of these. I got to ask up front, how much do you think people are spending on these seminars? So, and this is what, 2005, 2005, 2007, seven oh, people didn't know any better and they're man, maybe like 2 grand. I'm gonna just read a little passage from Stephen Gilpin's, OK? The new business model was designed to operate in two stages, first offering aspiring real estate magnates of free 90 minute profit from real estate orientation, also known as the Preview, where they be pressured to pay for the second stage, a three day profit from real estate workshop. During the workshop they'd be enticed and controlled into buying one of the Trump elite packages, which were offered at three price points, $9995 bronze, $19,495 silver and then the Whopper at $34,995. Sweet. It didn't stop there. During the Gold Elite program, there was constant pressure to purchase other Trump University affiliate programs and products varying in price from $495 to $9995. As a result, students could ultimately spend upwards of $70,000. Wait, so? The the first thing is free. First thing is free to get you to the second thing, which is only to get you to the so how much is the second thing? Like 1500 bucks sometimes, sometimes 1000. Some people pay like 500, like it was flexible a little bit, but whatever it is to get you there because they were really going to rip your head off. $1000, I mean, if you're a ******* loser, you get the bronze for 10 grand. And if you're really trying to, and I really want to see, yeah, they're just getting put together in there, yeah, we're going to get into their promotional material, not promotional, their sales material a little bit here. So the first live events were such a hit that Trump University almost immediately jettisoned all of its actual classes. Many of the course books continued to be sold on Amazon. And in fact, you can buy some today. But the study courses were dropped in, the website stopped being updated. The purpose of Trump University from here on out was to suck her. Rubes into free investment seminars to try and get them to pay outrageous sums of money for Trump gold elite packages. Now what are the what? What? Do you know what's in the package? Yeah so if you're paying $35,000 you're doing like a series, like a three day series of like of workshops. You're getting access to what they bill as. Like this, like secret listing of distressed properties that you can buy that other people don't have access to. You get access to this hotline and you get 3 days with a mentor who flies in to help you like understand your local real estate market and start. Setting up deals. OK. They also promise that they'll teach you how to do stuff like get your credit rating increased, presumably so that you can buy property. And they also promise you sources of hard money where you won't have to put your own money up. We'll we'll hook you up with our secret list of people who are willing to, like, invest in your and put up money to front it for you. Yeah. What? So that's what they're selling people. What they're telling people is what you get. And I'm sure what they got was something was different. Yeah. And what our listeners are going to get now is some ads. Mint Mobile offers premium wireless starting at just 15 bucks a month. And now for the plot twist. Nope, there isn't one. 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So LASIK Plus is a leader in laser vision correction in the United States. They have over 20 years in the industry and more than two million treatments performed. If you want to start your LASIK plus journey, you can get $1000 off when treated in September. That's 500 per eye so visitmylasikoffer.com to schedule your free consultation now. And we're back talking about Trump. You true university. I'm glad to do this, you know, with another fellow Trump. You alumna. Yeah. Yeah. It's been a lot of what is singular. Alumnus, alumni, whatever. Alumni. The two of us together. Alumni. Two of us together. Are you going to the reunion? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's. I forget where it is. I think the Queen Mary. Yeah. I think it's going to be fun. It's going to be great time. Although I heard it's not an open bar. That's a shame, but it's fine. I love that. Trump vodka. Yeah. Oh, man. Made from the finest old old potatoes. Of all of the liquor to brand after yourself. Yeah, Trump vodka. Only Dan Ackroyd's been able to get away with that. Yeah, well, people like to drink out of a skull. People like to drink out of a skull. People like to drink out of a skull more than they like to drink out of a tower. Oh yeah, that's the lesson. Is that the bottle first? Yeah, it's like shaped like one of his. Thanks. Yeah, get it together. Well, it didn't work out. But it's OK. I think he's doing all right now. Yeah, we'll see. We'll see now. During this whole time, The Apprentice continued to air and Trump's personal brand continued to rise among people who assume anyone wearing a suit on TV is a successful businessman. According to the New York Attorney General quote, Trump University speakers repeatedly insinuated that Donald Trump would appear at the three day seminar claiming that he is going to be in town, and often drops by and might show up or had just left or baited students with the promise of a surprise or a special guest speaker. As students later discovered these claims were untrue rather than being photographed. Donald Trump, they were offered the chance to have photos taken with a life sized photo of Donald Trump. I remember, I remember this thing like one of those great. It was like a cut out, right? Basically it's just a cut out of Trump that I love that kind of ****. You just missed him. He was just in here and he wanted to tell you guys. He told me personally to tell you guys that what you were doing is going to change your lives. Ah. He's going to be sick that he missed you guys. So bummed out. He is so bummed out anyway, if you just sign up for the 35 anyway package. Mark, let me talk to your ******* check. Bounced. ****. Free knowledge, *******. Trump University was, of course, deeply mixed up with the Trump Foundation, since that's sort of how the now president referred to run all of his businesses. Every check the business issued was signed by either Donald or one of his kids. Donald didn't have much, if anything, to say about the curriculum, such as it was, but he approved every single line of ad copy written about the business. And he testified to this in court like, I approved all of the ads, all of the promotional material. That's the only thing he did. And what were those ads like? Well, I found a couple. And. Yeah, we'll put them up on our site, behindthebastards.com. One of them features Donald Trump looking like Donald Trump in a suit with a big quote above a bunch of small text. And the big quote says, if you're not a millionaire by December 2008, you didn't attend my foreclosure workshop. Oh, another has the Trump University logo at the top, which features like a lion. Like rearing. Yeah, like a like a design of a lion rearing like, he's a ******* British nobleman. Yeah, yeah. And then it says unheard of real estate market factors have created a all caps bold, perfect storm of profit opportunity. Free Introductory class reserve your seat now. Attend this exciting introductory class and learn how you can profit all caps from the biggest real estate cash explosion in decades. Do you have like old ads from like snake oil salesman from like, the like the Wild West? Because I feel like those ads essentially read, like, have this same kind of presentation and enthusiasm, sort of capitalization of like, you'll never believe this thing from the Orient. It definitely looks like some of the bottles I've seen of like children's medicinal heroin. It's like amazing tonic. Wow. Amazing. The perfect storm for you to profit. Yeah. Now, when we talk about cons like this, there's always a risk of, like, coming down too hard on the people who fell for the scam. That's something I want to try to avoid because it is my firm belief that just about everyone has something they will fall for. In the same way these people fell for Trump University. Gilpin does a good job of sort of standing up for these people in his book, which is one reason that I have some respect for him. He's not mean about these people. They aren't dumb folks. Most of them were like nearing retirement age and spent. Years as, like, plumbers or like, one of them worked for, like, an aeronautics company and stuff. They just didn't know anything about real estate. Right. And they've saved up a lot, like a good amount. Got a nest egg? Yeah. Money. And they can just **** it away at this thing. Yeah, they want it. They want to try it out. They want to, like, make more money for retirement or something like that. And Donald Trump is the most famous person they know in real estate. They don't know anything about real estate. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Vanity Fair did a great job of collecting several of these people stories. I'd like to read an excerpt from their article. It starts with the. Dale of June Harris from White Plains, NY She took a Trump real estate course and found it valuable, so she signed up for a free session in June 2009. After seeing a newspaper ad quote, participants were told to keep $1000 in their pockets at all times. As a confidence builder for wealth, Harris signed up for the three day seminar which cost her $747.50. She spent the weekend of June 19th at the seminar, where she was encouraged to call her credit card company and increase her line of credit. They said that we should invest in property without ever touching our own assets, she wrote. The September 2012 affidavit, the instructor said if we surmounted the fear of losing money, then we would actually make money. She was then encouraged to sign up for the Trump Gold Mentorship program at a cost of $35,000, described as a year long group of seminars and private consultations with Trump instructors. When Harris declined, the agent was very upset and quickly hung up on the phone with me, she wrote in her affidavit. Yeah. At least she didn't get scammed out of the 35. I know, but I just like this person was probably being so terrible on the phone, too. She's like, I don't know, it's just a lot of money. Come on, you want to be poor all your life. You want to be poor? Come on, get it ******* together. You don't want what Donald Trump's offering you. You're not grateful. Oh, OK. So you're an idiot. Yeah. OK. That's fine then, *******. Then don't take up our time on our phone line. I don't think. Just shut the **** **. Just click. Just like. Oh my God. Trump university. So one of the things that was advertised. About these courses was that students would be able to learn how to increase their credit score and boost their credit limits, presumably so that they could again buy properties to flip Trump. You employees did coach students through how to get their credit limits increased, largely through lying. Students were taught to list their expected income as a result of the work in real estate they hadn't done yet. They were told to tell their banks that finding the documentation to prove any of this would be too hard, since they needed the limits increased. Now, somehow this often worked because credit card companies and banks are grifters too. Yeah, they're like, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Budget. We own you. Yeah, fine. We'll get the money either way. It was basically saying fake it to you. Make it in the sense that, like, Oh well, my projected income. And then they just write down, they're going to be a millionaire. That's your projected income. I'm thinking 3 to 4,000,000 a year, three to four million years. About right. Seems about right. Yeah. Yeah. Based on my experience cleaning my apartment. Yeah, I think I can make that much in real estate. Based on what I've been reading, yeah, that seems about right. OK, now, the credit increases were actually important because they were basically the only way normal people could hope to put together the 20 to $35,000 needed to pay for gold and silver level packages so that this didn't seem crazy Trump, you employees would point to the American higher education system. University is expensive after all. According to time quote, the teachers were always to be called faculty. A Crest that looked like it was borrowed from Harvard or Yale was embedded in the logo and admissions department was listed on the website. The marketing guidelines had sections called catch phrases, buzzwords and tone that encouraged the use of language such as elitist Ivy League. And think of Trump University as a real university with a real admissions process, IE not everyone who applies is accepted now. Gilpin points out that Trump did this too. In interviews and speeches where he had to make the case that his fake university was worth the money quote, Donald Trump often implied that Trump University was somehow inhabited, the same intellectual universe as Harvard University. In terms of cost, he was not far off, according to the Harvard website. The total 2015 to 16 cost of tuition at Harvard College without financial aid was $45,278, actually less than the so-called retail value of the Trump Gold Elite package. Because they said that the $35,000 package was worth $46,000. Oh, wow. Because of all the savings. Of all the savings. Hey, I'm taking a bath on this. Taking a bath on this. I'm *******. I'm just costing Donald Trump. Honestly, you know, if all you guys sign up, and I hate to say this, if all of you guys sign up for the gold package, I'm going to be totally upside down on this thing. Yeah, I'm going to be deep in the red. But you know what? Just to know that you guys are going to be successful, I'm willing to take that loss. It's like I'm there. I it's like I'm there. I wish we could get a bunch of materials and we should just, we should wrap them. Can we just do an episode where we run the Trump? You have the 135 page Trump University playbook. You know why? It's it's public domain because of the law. Yeah. Just I would love to just like read those like what the the style was and just hear recordings. Oh, we're going to pressure people. OK, great. We're going to great. Some of that, maybe not as much as I should have included these poor people too to know that they were sort of like the secret to making money is you need to call your bank right now and get that credit extended because you need to pay for this to pay $35,000 because I'm selling you air. Ah, it's amazing. It really is now. Like most big businesses, Trump University had a company playbook which we just talked about, 130 some page document that is now on my iPad next to five biographies of Hitler. It included everything from how far ahead of time employees should show up before seminar as to what they should wear in order to make the company look good. It also included a lot of advice on how speakers could convince someone to drop $35,000 on this ********. Thanks to the shameful mountain of lawsuits this fake school inspired, we have access to this wonderful document. Politico actually has it available. The PDF so you can download it right now. Ohh, grew up on our site. Yeah. Yeah, we'll put the link up there. Most of it's boring. But the part that talked about how to sell the workshops to reticent students is really interesting to me, especially since one of the few things we know that Donald Trump actually did for Trump University was approved. The playbook. Right. This is all Trump and possibly Trump dictated in some cases. Do you think that's the case or like, because I can't imagine him putting work into anything that someone else did it? And he goes, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, but one thing that's consistent even when you hear about, like, Roger Stone. And he working on those racist ads against the Mohawk tribe to try to like get their casinos band. He was noted as specifically approving the ads. I think that might just be something he really does care about approving ad copy, ad copy and lighting and marketing material. Marketing material because I mean that's that's what he's good at, right? And I guess in a way that's the written version of his identity being out there too. So he wants to be careful with it. I guess I would. I would not be surprised if that he put in legitimate work just to make sure. I also though wouldn't be surprised. He goes, yeah, it's fine. OK yeah. Yeah. If he if he's just like, yeah, it's whatever. Oh yeah. Because he he would also brag. He's like, yeah, I did all the work. I actually typed everything with a typewriter, with a typewriter, and I didn't even look at my fingers, didn't look at my fingies did the home row, man. There you go. I don't know if he's ever typed, you know he has, but he's like for the camera and he just uses index fingers. Yeah, he's a hunting ****** for sure. And he only uses 1 ******* hand. Shots fired? Yeah. Sorry. So here's how the Trump University Playbook advises an instructor on how to deal with a student who keeps asking what inconvenient questions? Someone who has too many questions for the sales teacher. I'm surprised there was some derogatory nickname in the manual. It's like if you get one of these, it gets kind of mean, actually. OK. OK, so here's the handbook instructing the teacher right the more concerns you have to resolve, the more power you have given the other person, and they will begin to enjoy the power on a subconscious level. They don't even realize it, but having us wait on them gives them a feeling of supremacy, and they feel they are an important sale to us. Do not get in conversations where you answer one question after the other, yet getting no closer to the sale whatsoever. Irrelevant questions take too much time. You lose power by answering them. The person asking the questions always has the power. You should only allow potential students. To ask one of these questions and then take back the power. When you answer one of these questions, give a quick answer and then start asking questions. Examples. I'm not sure who developed the property. I think the real question we should be asking ourselves is Are you ready to change your current lifestyle? Do not let potential students have more than one concern. What? So if they're like $35,000, it's my health, you know, that's money that could be going to some medical treatments that would allow me to extend my life to keep doing this. It's remarkable because if you, if you've ever bought like a a newish car, any car, really, if you buy it from like a lot, you're spending in that ballpark 10 to $35,000 and you're you're going up against like a salesman, but they'll always answer, they'll lie in their answers to your questions, but they'll answer a lot of questions because they know it seems shady to do anything else. Well, but The thing is, at least they know they're selling you a car. Yeah. It is a thing that does it. Yeah. And, like, they you can actually drive away in it and it will do probably most of what it advertises. Whereas this is like, you got to do this high pressure **** to be like, look, bro, if they're, if they're asking too many questions, these aren't people are going to buy who are going to fall for it anyway? Yeah. It's not like, like fudging when someone asks if a car is like, undercoating, like, how well it works. Oh yeah, yeah. You're like, oh, those weather mats, all weather. Yeah. You're going to be fine. You're going to be fine. Yeah, they'll do great. So the playbook notes that students should be asked what they do and how many hours a week they are working, as well as whether or not they love their job. The reason to ask this is not simple human interest, but in case someone says they don't have the time to sign up for a three day workshop. Well, you can come at them strongly and throw this right back at them. Well, insert students name. The only reason you don't have the time right now is because you're working 45 hours at a job you don't enjoy. I won't even bring up the hours after you factor in. All the time you sit in traffic taxes and everything else that's taken out of your paycheck. Have you added up what you net an hour? I bet you wouldn't like that number. You're trying to fool yourself, but you're not fooling me. You came down here today because you're tired of killing yourself just to survive. We will show you how to thrive in real estate and control your own financial destiny. And the best part is when you double your income from real estate. Part time, you can quit your job, work 25 hours a week, and create more wealth than you have ever dreamed of. Now let's take it one step at a time. Follow me and let's get you enrolled. Listen closely to the orientation. It's possible if you do exactly what we tell you, we may be able to start helping you put together a deal next Saturday. Congratulations. Oh, wow. What a journey. He just took me on. That was a whole look at you. You're pathetic. You make $0.40 an hour. Yeah. What the ****? Wow. The and it literally ends with congratulations. Congratulations. Holy yeah. There's an exclamation point that is forceful. To be like. Yeah, well, you'll be closing a deal. Congratulations. You've decided you're doing it, and I'm and honestly, you're the future generations of your family are also. Thank all going to thank you now. Right this second. Babies are going to be out of the time stream. And give you their thanks. How does that feel? How does that feel to start a dynasty? You really should have written copy for them. I sell cars. Yeah, I'll bet you did. Ohh, yo. The people you learn, like, I wasn't really good at closing because I couldn't lie, but I picked up. So I'm just, you know, like anything that's funny to me, like, I'll kind of obsess about. And there were the people around me were ******* in, like, they they would say **** like that. And there would be like, hey, look, you know, a man and woman come in looking for the truck, obviously got to sell the man. OK? But here's the thing, man. You can't ignore the wife, man, because guess what? The neck. It ******* turns the head, OK? And if you don't tend to that. The sales ******* gone and you're like, holy **** Oh my God. Yeah, I'm like, wow. This something you thought of, like, yeah, as I live, because I live in my van still. There's a guy who did live in his van. He was just saving his money. Yeah. So he just shared. It was really weird. He lived in his van but was like, closing deals. And I'm not sure what happened to him. I mean, he's probably, like, working in Eric Prince's weird Bootleg Air Force or bootleg Wall building company. So I had to fight myself over how exactly how much of this stuff to include. I kind of fell down a route rabbit hole. When I started reading this player I I stepped into this expecting to find sleeves, but I didn't anticipate just how abusive it would all sound. So here's here's like a chunk of a Q&A between a a student and a sales teacher. Objection. I like this, but I'll do it later. And here's what the teacher is supposed to say in response. I'm glad you made it down here today and didn't procrastinate like you're doing now. Have you added up how much money you have? Just by procrastinating in your life, it sounds like it's a very bad habit for you. If I had $10,000 in my hand and I said and I said I'll give it to you for $2000, would you have to think about it or make a smart financial decision? Well, **** you, Trump university. What the ****? Ohh, it's amazing. Well, Congrats. But it looks like you're doing that thing you always do. Always do, you ***** ** ****. Yeah. OK, loser. Keep keep ******* the dollars away. Yeah, yeah. Enjoy living in the garbage trash, man. Yeah. You said your mom passed away, huh? Wow. That's a shame. Was it from shame? Was it from shame? It was from shame. Because of because of. Your child is such a yeah, honestly, you make me sick. Get out of here. Get out of this. Wow, that's some real gaslight he ****. It is some really gas lighty ****. Yeah, the playbook uses the term set. The hook. Describe the purpose of those free previews, which we're again billed as actual, informative sessions for people interested in real estate. Set the hook because the hook catching prey. Pray that you're killing right and you'll devour everything. Eat and destroy. Take every bit of value you can out of it. Bones and pick your teeth with the bones. Now. Teachers were directed to pretend they knew Donald Trump in order to make to better make the case that students should listen to them. Here's time. I remember one time Mr Trump had us over for dinner, the script read, after which the instructor recounted how Trump had confided some nugget of real estate wisdom to him. No, I didn't have dinner with him, conceded Gerald Martin when questioned in a 2013 deposition about a recorded presentation in which he mouths the scripts. Dinner with Trump line. I was just trying to be as close to the script as possible. Wow. Ohh man, that's my favorite kind of ******** too. The best, you know? I don't know. Have you? You ever had a steak dinner before? OK, great. So I was just actually with Donald Trump and at his house, I mean, obviously, this man is only going to find sticks. And when I was there, he brought out this beef. It's from Japan. It's called Kobe beef now. You know Kobe Bryant? Yeah. He's named after this place because the beef is so good now it is. It's it's a kind of beef that melts in your mouth. And I'm not saying that to impress you. I'm saying that to impress upon you that I actually have from my personal relationship with Donald Trump. Learn the kinds of skills, techniques, strategies to be eating that kind of meal as if it were an afterthought, as if it were your, I don't know, hot pocket. Based on your body type that I'm looking at. There needs to be like a government registry for people who can do what you do. Or do we just keep tabs on them? Just fast talkers? Maybe it's just weird I'm too empathetic, like to like, actually *******. Yeah, but I love this. This is safe. Have you ever seen the documentary Marjoe? No, it's a it's a documentary about this kid who was like his parents made him be a preacher. This is like in like the 30s and 40s when he was like starting at like age 5. He was like marrying people as a 6 year old. There's video of some of this. And as an adult, like, he couldn't do anything else but this his whole life. So as an adult, after his parents abandoned him, he got back into basically conning people out of money as a preacher in these like big revivals that were happening all the way across the South. And he felt bad about it because he had a soul. And so he took a documentary film crew in with him and like the 70s to record behind the scenes. What happens in all these scam revivals? It's an incredible movie. Wow. It's an incredible movie. But he's got this ability to just, like, turn that on and start going right. These, these beautiful, like, like evangelical rants. And it's the same sort of thing. Like, it's just amazing to watch. Wow. You know that? Impress you. I'm not here to impress you. Impress upon you that Tony Robbins line. Oh yeah. That sounds like a Tony Robbins line. Good on you. And he says that he's like, and, you know, I've got, he literally said some **** is like, and now I've got a Rolex. Yeah. And he's like, and I don't say that to him. Rescue. I say that to impress upon him. Like, oh, wow, lick ******* line. That is a good that it's not an unskilled job. No, not at all. Say that. Especially when you have lines like that, that you're like, whoa, like, OK, all right, all right. Weird, flex, but OK, you deserve something for that. Oh yes. Oh, man. ****. The time quote even continues because they asked Donald Trump about the the guy's dinner story and he said, I don't know who you're talking about, but I will tell you that I met many of the professors and I also studied just about all of the resumes. I'm very much into academics, you know, I was a good student. Dude, I met the professor. I met the professors. What the **** are you talking about? These maniacs who were just lying through their teeth? The President, the President, the training was in fact ********. What training there was that wasn't just upselling people, since most instructors had either no real estate experience or were failed real estate investors who'd gone bankrupt in the field. They weren't exactly filled with good advice to begin with. Stephen Gilpin, who was an actual real estate expert, although that's a pretty scammy field inherently. But he actually was had, like certifications and stuff and had done this for years. But he said he had gone bankrupt. No, no, no, no. He just he just, like, his company stopped doing as well because the market started to crash. So he was like, well, this is guaranteed money. Got you guys OK? Yeah. So Stephen Gilpin, since he actually knew something about real estate and like the laws surrounding it, was ground 00 for witnessing the kind of noxious nonsense that was spouted at these these seminars. Quote, one day I got an incoming call from a student, let's call him Sunil. He said I'm here at the department of specific well. I mean, I guess a lot of people who were like recent immigrants to the country and managed to save up some money got involved in was saying, like, let's call him Sunil. Like, yeah, I would hate for the guy's name to be a nil. Let's call him to be honest. From what I can tell about Gilpin, that might have been. Mr X, that's called Mr X, he said. I'm here at the Department of Records and deeds trying to file documents and they won't accept my paperwork. OK? I said, what are you trying to do? I'm filing an affidavit to cloud a title, said Sunil. And they won't take it. Now, clouding a title is a real estate term. It basically means it refers to an irregularity in the chain of title of real estate property. And it's one of those things you can do in. Sometimes it makes it hard to for another buyer to, like, go after the title, essentially like that. I don't entirely. Understand it. But it's a kind of shady thing that is legal in some states. Yes. Well, let me tell you something, Robert, is it is legal, and I do have experience with that. It's actually how I don't know if you've seen this is an Audemars Piaget wristwatch I'm wearing. I got, you know, the name of a nice wristwatch. OK, so once he hears that this guy's trying to cloud a title, the third first thing in Stephen Gilpin's head is like he starts thinking through the states. He knows where it's illegal to do this, to try to see like if that's what's happening. Right. I noticed the 480 area code of his call. Phoenix, AZ. You've made a mistake. I've said what you're trying to do can't be done in the state of Arizona. It's illegal. But this is what our mentor told us to do. He said, wait, what? I said where did you learn this? At the Trump University retreat in Scottsdale. So this kid had paid $5000 to get a step by step advice to do something that was illegal in the state. That he was trying to do it in, since he went ahead and signed the illegal document before being reported he had technically committed a crime that could have resulted in a $10,000 fine and a year of jail time. Oh wow. Wow. So when you get right down to it, Trump University wasn't just a con. It was a shockingly bad and unspeakably lazy con, and it's about to get shocking her lazier and somehow even grosser. When we return on Thursday, we'll talk about the kind of human beings who worked as teachers at Trump University. We'll talk about the downfall of Trump. University and we'll talk about what it taught our President to be about the magic of conning people out of money, miles. Plegables pluggable Ales Glade plugins love them. And also you know, I Co host the daily zeitgeist on this network. Daily News and politics and culture comedy, you know have some laughs. Talk about the news laughs. Think, learn. Yeah love love. But you won't hear the kind of slick sales **** I do here. This is exclusive from behind the baskets I and yeah follow me on you know social media Twitter, Instagram at miles of Gray GRA. MLS so enjoy this world exclusive miles trying to sell you on con stuff. And enjoy our episode on Thursday when we return with the rest of the story of Trump University. You can find usonlinebehindthebastards.com. You can find us on Instagram and Twitter at ******** pod. You can buy a shirt. You could also buy my real estate investment guide investing with Robert. I wrote it all myself. Now I've never invested in real estate and in fact one year I lost 10s of thousands of dollars by renting a. What was essentially a mansion for no good reason. So yeah, weird flex, but OK not a flex. Almost, almost made me homeless. So, but you had 10s of thousands of dollars, man. Yeah, that's a bit of info was there. And I call that. I invested the money I made from my book in living in a giant house and going to Iraq three times. Wow. 2 great investments called Living Your Best life, Robert. So if you want to buy my book of real estate secrets, it's 4495 investing with Robert $4495 and I promise you less than 40% of what is in the book is illegal in your state. Oh great, not valid in Arizona, New York, New Mexico, New Jersey. Rhode Island. Michigan. And the rest of the eastern seaboard? The rest of the eastern seaboard, also with Lanta just also Louisiana. Just Atlanta. The City of Atlanta. Rest of Georgia, you're fine. You're fine. All right. This has been behind the ********. I've been Robert Evans. Hug a cat. Hello, I'm Erica Kelly from the podcast Southern Fried True crime, and if you want to go from podcast fan to podcast host, do what I did and check out spreaker from iheart. I was working in accounting and hating it. Then after just 18 months of podcasting with Spreaker, I was able to quit my day job. Follow your podcasting dreams, let's break our handle the hosting, creation, distribution, and monetization. Of your podcast, go to spreaker.com. That's spreaker.com. Hey there, it's Ebony Monet, your co-host for the San Diego Zoo's Amazing Wildlife podcast. In this special episode, we're speaking with Doctor Jane Goodall about the fascinating journey that led to her social discoveries on chimpanzees. So four whole months, the chimps ran away from me. I mean, they take one look at this peculiar white ape and disappear into the vegetation. In wildlife on the iHeartRadio app, or wherever you get your podcasts, hey y'all, it's Caroline Hobby hosted get real with Caroline Hobby interviewing the most fascinating people in Nashville and beyond. I talked to artists, I talked to the wives of artists. I talked to women entrepreneurs who have created businesses who are moms, who juggle a million hats and do it all. Each episode will leave you inspired, feeling like you can accomplish your own dream and calling listen to new episodes of get Real with Caroline Hobby every Monday on the Nashville. Broadcast Network available on iHeartRadio App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcast.