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ICHH: That Time the CIA dosed a French Town with Acid: Spooky Week #1

ICHH: That Time the CIA dosed a French Town with Acid: Spooky Week #1

Mon, 25 Oct 2021 04:02

A look at the poisoning of the town Pont Saint Esprit, and how some mysterious bread turned hundreds of residents temporarily mad.

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Hello, I'm Erica Kelly from the podcast Southern Fried True crime, and if you want to go from podcast fan to podcast host, do what I did and check out spreaker from iheart. I was working in accounting and hating it. Then after just 18 months of podcasting with Spreaker, I was able to quit my day job. Follow your podcasting dreams, let's break or handle the hosting, creation, distribution, and monetization of your podcast. Go to That's Hey there, it's Ebony Monet, your co-host for the San Diego Zoo's Amazing Wildlife podcast. In this special episode, we're speaking with Doctor Jane Goodall about the fascinating journey that led to her social discoveries on chimpanzees. So four whole months, the chimps ran away from me. I mean, they take one look at this peculiar white ape and disappear into the vegetation. Bing wildlife on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's Chuck Wicks from love country. Talk to Chuck where we bring you what's really happening in the country music family. We also, if you love country, here's the deal. You love country music. You can be on the podcast. So if you're a fan country music or you can call in anytime. Like I want to talk about this. Hulk Hogan called in. He's like Chuck Walker. I love your podcast. Jason Aldean, Jimmy Allen, Carly Pierce, Lauren Elena. Listen to new episodes of love Country talk to Chuck every Monday and Thursday. The Nashville podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcast Raffi is the voice of some of the happiest songs of our generation. So who is the man behind baby beluga? Every human being wants to feel respected. When we start with young children, all good things can grow from there. I'm Chris Garcia, comedian, new dad and host of finding Raffi, a new podcast from iHeartRadio and fatherly. Listen, every Tuesday on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts, executive producer Paris Hilton brings back the hit podcast how men think. And that's good. News for anyone that is confused by men, which is basically everyone. It's real talk straight from the source. The how Men Think podcast is exactly what we need to figure them out. It's going to be fun, informative, and probably a bit scary at times because we're literally going inside the minds of men. Listen to how men think on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Gangster Chronicles Podcast is a weekly conversation that revolves around underworld criminals and entertainers to victims of crime and law enforcement. We cover all facets of the game. Gangster Chronicles podcast doesn't glorify promote illicit activities. We just discussed the ramifications and repercussions of these activities because after all, if you play gangster games, you are ultimately rewarded with gangster prizes. iHeartRadio is number one for podcast, but don't take our word for it. Find the Gangster Chronicles podcast on. By heart radio app or wherever you get your podcast. Welcome to Spooky Week, a week where we are. Not really any spookier, honestly, than the average things happening, because everything happening is is terrifying like ghosts and ghouls are are are a lot more fun anyway. What? Hang up in this podcast, don't listen. Go watch Herbert W Reanimator. Have some fun. But if you decide to keep listening to podcasts for some reason, we have a bunch of spooky content for you this week. How is that? How's that introduction, Sophie? Bad. Who? Spooky. Scary. Garrison, get going. Do your thing. Yeah, my, my thing. So yeah, we're doing, we're doing spooky spooky week, which is very excited about. But yeah, everyone I've told about spooky week, they're like, oh, so it's just a regular week for for the show. Like, you know, pretty much. No, no, it's more fun. It is in a few ways. It is actually going to be more fun because the the the the the spooky spooky mind bending tails commit to the God dammit. Yeah, spooky mind bending tales actually do have do have some more fun than just the solely depressing ones. The first theme week that we all agreed upon, this was the first theme. It's like, can we do something around Spooky Lyness near Halloween and everybody you know roughly said yes, yes, yes. So this is the first theme week we have. We, we have, we have been promising not week coming up eventually. What about things that made us nut or where we talk about the legumes? Mostly legumes. OK, that's fair. But anyway, we should we should start off with our first our first spooky tale. So I'm, I'm going, I'm going to tell a very, very spooky tail of a of an entire French town going going mad over the course of a single week. Yeah, probably. Probably with the help of psychoactive drugs and a certain three letter agency. You know what? Think we're gonna get to do Garrison? It's just the French accent. I did somebody online. I did get a few messages that you can't be racist against the French. They're like the British or Americans. I did get a few messages saying that your French accent was very racist. To the French, there is a certain number. It's like the Germans. There's a certain number of genocides after which people get to make fun of your country and it's not racist. And that number is, let's say, 3. Honestly, the the worst part of this story is that we're probably doing critical support for France. I mean, you know, in a way well. Honestly, I'm gonna be kind of more critical support to the CIA by the end of this one. Exactly. Yeah, that's that is the most critical support can be. So anyway, our very spooky tale begins in 1951 in a small, charming French village called Pont St Esprit, which is how I'm going to say that yeah, there you go. So not much happened in this little picturesque little town on the South side of France. You know, on the day we start, it's just like a regular summer day. People are going about their routine, going to their jobs, kids are playing in the street, enjoying some delicious freshly baked bread, but suddenly. Strange things begin happening and I'm going to start off with some of the more mild, mild, mild effects here. So on August 15th, 1st, dozens, then hundreds of people began first just complaining of nausea, you know, and and some people with some like stomach and abdominal pain, they're coming up less often, less often. Noted there was a few instances like vomiting and diarrhea. I believe 30% of people had diarrhea. That is. That is a weirder, weirder thing. That's a lot of diarrhea. Yeah, that is on like a town wide basis, 3% thirty significant 30. Sorry. Yeah. That's a significant strain on the suit which is 3030% of the people affected, which is going to be like a few 100 versus. I was taking drugs with a group of friends and a third of them had diarrhea. I would say we might need to go to a hospital. This is a sign that we have taken some of that perhaps what we got was tainted. There is, there is, yeah. Well we'll be talking about what actually what the actual drugs being used here are going to be, but. That's gonna come anitas or something where that's not an uncommon side effect, but yeah, yeah. First. First, nausea. A little, a little bit of vomiting, stomach pains, cramping. Hospitals began reporting people experiencing alternating warm and cold waves over their entire body. The British Medical Journal recalls abundant sweating and a disagreeable odor, which I'm guessing the odor is just because there's all this sweating people in the same cramped hospital room in the summer in the summer heat. So anyway, and they're French, so. How to escargo sweats. It's all I'm saying. I don't wanna get more messages saying that I have to stop by saying that he's going to do it more. By the way, do we know that the diarrhea was the result of of whatever substance? Or maybe it's just the wine ***** again. We don't we? There's no way to tell. There's no way to know. So, yeah. Patients began complaining about weird pains and pressure around their neck, which yeah, and one of the one of the most reported symptoms was insomnia, in some cases lasting several days. Quoting the British Medical Journal, the first symptoms appeared after a latent period of 6 to 48 hours. The digestive disorders quickly became worse, with burning sensations through the entire digestive tract. Some experience sensations of burning at the ****. A state of giddiness persisted. I mean, who's not giddy when your **** is burning? Am I right? I do. Like, this is like, this is like the like the clearest side that there's like some some psychoactive drug going on because, like, your **** is burning and gets you're very gyped you are on board. Yeah. It's like that sign from that. What is that from a rejected by. What's that, cartoonist? Like, my **** is bleeding, but, like, you're down. You know you're down for it. Yeah, yeah, you're you're you're 110% so John Mulaney impression. No, no, no. It's who did reject it. That was bad. It wasn't a John Laney impression. Sophie. OK, that's just your poison to millennial Don Hertzfeld. Yeah, great artist. Yep, great artist. So these pale and limp patients, still quoting the British Medical Journal, these pale and limp patients showed inconspicuous trembling of the extremities and they complained of disorders of the visual accommodation and especially being unable to read. So this this is this is the more mild this is the. This could be a long one there. So this is for many people affected. This is where the symptoms stopped after suffering for insomnia for a while with you know mild disorders of the visual accommodation and you know and stomach pains and like weird like neck things after they were able to sleep. That was the sign of their recovery is like the ability to sleep again after the insomnia wore off. But in a in around 50 of the cases reported the effects were much more intense. I'm going to continue from the from the medical. 1st and then get into some of the more colorful reporting around the incident, quoting the medical journal again, vivid visual hallucinations appeared in particular themes of visions of animals and of flames. All of these visions were fleeting, invariable in many of the patients, they were followed by dreamy delirium. Yeah, that's that's about right. That's actually a pretty good description of like LSA, LSD. Those kind of like the movies always get it wrong because you're not usually not like you're not seeing some sort of like visual like cartoon. World, it's it's these kind of like fleeting impressions of visions and things in the corner of your eyes. Yeah, that's a pretty good, especially a lower like it is unclear what exactly they were on because they definitely can be the more cartoon. I mean you can get full open eyed hallucination, like especially the Shogun chemicals will do that, but I don't get it so much with like LSD, LSA? Now let's say if you want to **** yourself, that is. That is just right. Some Hawaiian baby woodrose seeds. Yeah, so from Home Depot and have yourself a horrible night. So the delirium seemed to be systematized, with animal hallucinations and self accusation was weird. Weird terms from the from the medical journal accusations. Yeah. It's. I think. I think they're trying to get at ego death but they don't have terms for it yet. Either that or that like sometimes you're hallucinating it like overcome like guilt. Like, oh, I did this terrible thing. Yeah yeah yeah. Everybody's angry at me or whatever. Like continuing from the medical journal. So self accusation and and it was sometimes mystical or McCabe in some cases terrifying visions were followed by fungus, which is an old term for like fugues. It says he says fugues. It's it's pronounced fugue. Yeah. It's like, it's it's like, it's like extreme, extreme disassociation. Yeah, yeah. You're kind of zombified a little bit, yeah. And two and two patients through themselves out the window. Yeah, if the delirium was of a confusao kind, which could be interpreted for some moments by a strong stimulation, every attempt at restraint increased the agitation. Well, yeah, that's it. That is really restraining. I've had to restrain a number of people and it does not calm anyone down. Especially like to be restrained, specially when you're tripping hard. Yeah, this sounds like a real, real bad time. Not the thing to do. In severe cases, muscular spasms appeared the duration of these periods of delirium. Was varied. They lasted several several hours in some patients, and in others they persisted overnight. So that and then here it's it's gonna get a little bit darker and then we're gonna have more fun. We observed 4 fatal cases, three men and one woman. Three of these people were old and in bad health. One of the men was only 25 years old and had had been in good health previously. They died in a muscular spasm in a state of cardiovascular collapse. I think this is probably mostly due to how the doctors were handling these patients, right. I mean obviously your your blood pressure one that can elevate when you're when you're hallucinating. But yeah I think it also has a lot to do with. The way they were being handled, yeah, you're right, the disorders developed more quickly in children, but also left them more quickly. An interesting feature some of the cases was that the delirium was the first sign to be noted. So it depends. People come up, came up on different ways, right? Some of them first had weird body feelings, some of them first started just seeing stuff. One other interesting tidbit that we're not going to spend much time talking about, but like around two weeks after this initial incident, some symptoms started to reappear, either through like a secondary poisoning or it was like some kind of like acid flashback. Yeah, it must. It must because I've I've done a ******** of acid. I've never had a flashback. I did at one point. I mean, I have like done some damage and so I have permanent tracers, but it's not like. I my guess is they got it. I think the idea that there are like acid flashbacks that are vivid hallucinations has been pretty heavily debunked. My guess is they got re dosed. I don't know, I might fight you. Yeah. Like it could be that it was traumatic enough that, like, they're having, they're dealing with PTSD and kind of that's what's happening. But I don't know. And I think I definitely have seen enough reports that would see acid flashbacks definitely actually being a thing in some cases, especially in like the early days of studying these types of drugs and like the 60s like this, the CIA reported a lot of stuff around acid flashbacks around the people that they tortured. But I guess if it's, if it's tied to torture, that could just be PTSD stuff, could be PTSD. It's also, I mean, one thing you have to know, and I don't know what kind of dose these people are getting with the CIA. Would those people? They were sometimes giving people doses. Yeah. People do not take like, you do not take that much. Yeah. Like hundreds or thousands or millions of likes. Yeah. Yeah. That's ridiculous, irresponsible doses. Yeah. So now we're going to get to some of the, some of the more fun descriptions here, which we can actually kind of like, based on our experiences, can actually kind of see like what was actually going on in these people's heads. So basically we had at least dozens and dozens of people tripping very, very hard, the local postman. He's doing his rounds on his bicycle when he was suddenly overwhelmed by nausea and wild hallucinations, quoting him. It was terrible. I had the sense I had the sensation of shrinking and shrinking and the fire and the serpents coiling around my arms. Yeah, that guy had some other stuff going on. Yeah, because the very first acid trip was on a bicycle. When Heinrich Hoffman, like made it and dosed himself, he started coming up. I believe it was Amsterdam, like riding his bicycle, which is like, well, this is lovely. I've made something cool. Why was the postman riding a bicycle? To deliver packages and because they're in France, because it's your France. We do not have the vehicles. The 1950s, it's not there. France in 1924. I mean that's. I'm sorry post. So, yeah, the mailman fell off his bike and was taken to the taken to a hospital in a nearby town. He was put in a straight jacket and he shared a room with three teenagers who were also tripping. And the teenagers were changed to their beds to keep them under control. Yeah, that's that's how you sound, right? Persuaded Trip flashbacks to this, to being chained to a bed while tripping. Yeah, that's a bad thing to do. Some of my friends tried to get out of the window. They were thrashing wildly, screaming and the sound of the metal beds and jumping up and down the noise was terrible. I put. I would. I would prefer to die than go through that again, you know? Yeah, totally terrible. This sounds like the worst acid trip you could go off. That sounds like about the worst way you could have a trip. Go. It sounds awful. Yeah. So back in the French town. A little girl screamed as she was being chased by man eating tigers. Oh my goodness, a woman sobbed about how her children had been grounded to sausages. Oh great. No. So graphic and specific. Yeah, a large bed defended off a terrific beast by smashing his furniture and using the wood as weapons. Good for you, buddy. Good for you. A husband and wife right around chasing each other with knives. Again, probably something else going on there. My my guess is we're not just talking the acid in in that, because I have again been on acid a lot around knives and other weapons. I have never cheated anybody. I've never chased someone around with knives and a couple who was on the verge of a knife chick. I think, I think, I think the important part here is that, like in 1951 in this French town, like, acid wasn't a thing yet. Like, like, like, like like hallucinogenic drugs weren't a thing, right? Even even like mushrooms weren't popular. This time, no one knew what what the hell was going on. Like they just think that they're just basically losing their minds. Like there's there's no other explanation for what's happening to them. To say that the most shocking thing that has come out so far is that when Robert was on acid, he wasn't chasing people with knives. That seems like it's honest, like, depending on your acid trip, you wouldn't want to chase them with a knife. Like it's not, that's not the kind of headspace you're in. We would, we would like during this sober. Yeah, we would. We would take a bunch of drugs and grab my AK47 and hike out into the woods. And we would shoot down a fur tree and we would drag it back to a clearing and we would bury it standing up and we would drape it in pig intestines and put a pig's heart. And when we cover it in gasoline and light it with firecrackers and dance around it like the pagans of old, but there was nothing aggressive about no, you, you, you very rarely would want to hurt somebody on acid. In my experience, like you, you generally generally are at least you're like, way more compassionate and in a lot of ways. But if you have no idea what acid is and you're just you're in the 1950s and you're losing your mind and you're seeing weird things, then yeah, I can see how this would maybe cause some other types of behavior. You just think that, like, God is angry at you. Yeah. Yeah. Like, like, like, they're not, they're not dosing themselves either. They're being dosed, right, like they don't. It's very different. We're like you're deciding to go on a trip versus this is happening to you and you have no decision. I think for basically anyone in this position, the logical assumption would be, oh, the devil has taken over our town and our minds have we have been infested with demons. Like, what else are you going to assume? You're not going to be like, oh, this drug that's just barely been invented and that nobody really knows about yet except for weird nerds? It must be some version of that. That I've taken accidentally no, you're going to do so like no demons are in your blood. So one interesting tidbit before we before we go on break even, some of the local animals had been affected by whatever poison to the town there. There was there was one dog in particular that kept chewing on rocks until its teeth chipped away. I don't like this. And and ducks were behaving very odd. It's described it they they were they were walking around erect and upright like Penguins in a line. 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You can get matched with a therapist after filling out a brief survey, and if the therapist that you get matched with doesn't wind up working out, you can switch therapists at any time when you want to be a better problem solver, therapy can get you there. Visit behind today to get 10% off your first month. What's My name is Erica Kelly and I am the host and creator of Southern Freight true crime. There are so many people that just have no idea that has an incredible show. I want them to make money. I want them to be able to do what I did. Follow your podcasting dreams. Let's break your handle the hosting, creation, distribution and monetization of your podcast. Go to That's. get paid to talk about the things you love with spreaker from iheart this fall on revisionist history. Is there anything that we haven't talked about or or I should have asked you or you'd like to add that seems relevant? You should have asked me why I'm missing fingers on my left hand. A story about sacrifice. I think his suffering drove him to try to alleviate suffering. And the shocking discovery I made where I faced the consequences of writing a book I thought would help people? Isn't that funny? It's not funny at all. It's depressing. Very depressing. Revisionist history is back with more. Listen to revisionist history on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. I've never seen less enthusiasm for a great idea in my life. To dose our ducks scarce we are not we're not wasting acid. On the ducks. No on the lot. I mean there's a lot of things you could give ducks so we're not we're not giving ducks asset that's not happening about giving ducks drugs is they're all monsters. That is true. They are monsters and rapists. Every one of them. Yeah, all of the male ducks. So anyway, I'll reoccurring theme was that people were running around wildly and being very fearful of like monstery animals and encroaching flames. Sounds like the Ducks are having a good time. The ducks. The Ducks are doing their Ministry of Silly Walks. ****. Like, I don't know what all these people are bummed about. This is red. OK, so when you first said that I heard dogs and I was like, that is the most terrible thing I've ever heard. Ducks. Ducks is much funnier. It's like ducks and they like very upright, like Penguins walking around in the line. I think ducks might enjoy it. I think dogs are a little too aware of what's going on. Garrison didn't say dog the the the stone thing was about the dog, but yeah, the, the, the, the the dog and scary. Yeah. I just don't know that. The dogs. Enjoy. Because, like, I've seen dogs accidentally eat large amounts of pot and whatnot, and they they they are they get weird. They they're pretty scared. They're pretty scared. Yeah, yeah. Do you know what is also very spooky? Vitalism yeah, capitalism and all of these spooky advertisements to sell you things. Advertisements are also a form of mind control. Speaking of the CIA in the 50s anyway. Profoundly damaging. What's up guys? I'm Rashad Balao and I am Troy Millings and we are the host of the earn your Leisure podcast where we breakdown business models and examine the latest trends in finance. We hold court and have exclusive interviews with some of the biggest names in business, sport and entertainment from DJ Khaled to Mark Cuban, Rick Ross and Shaquille O'Neal. I mean, our alumni list is expansive. Listen in as our guests reveal their business models, hardships and triumphs in their respective fields. The knowledge is in death and the questions are always delivered from your standpoint. We want to know what you want to know. We talked to the legends of business, sports and entertainment about how they got their start and most importantly how they make their money earning. Alicia is a college business class mixed with pop culture. Want to learn about the real estate game? Unclear is how the stock market works. 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Our new season is about a lawyer who helped the mob run Chicago. We controlled the courts. We controlled absolutely everything. He bribed judges and even helped a hit man walk free until one day when he started talking with the FBI and promised that he could take the mob down. I've spent the past year trying to figure out why he flipped and what he was really after. From my perspective, Bob was too good to be true. There's got to be something wrong with this. I wouldn't trust that guy. He looks like a little scumbag liar, stool pigeon. He looked like what? He was a rat. I can say with all certainty I think he's a hero because he didn't have to do what he did, and he did it anyway. The moment I put the wire around the first time my life was over. If it ever got out, they would kill me in a heartbeat. Listen to deep cover on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We are back from the spooky advertising called it yeah. Anyway, so I think another another reoccurring factor for why a lot of these people have very similar types of experiences around like snakes, which we'll talk about later. And like flames is like with this many people tripping and no one knows tripping is, I think it's really easy for an idea or a fear to spread from one person to another while they're tripping. With like this many people, I think if someone says something it's gonna start happening to someone else and it's kind of this like cascading effect where they all develop these very similar fear is because it's almost like being spread like an infection. So there was there was a one man convinced that red snakes were devouring his brain, and he jumped out of a window. Oh no. What? Did he did he live through this? He did live. I'm guessing a lot of these. It's it's like France and the 50s. So I'm guessing most of these buildings are not super. They're not. They're not super high. No, no, they're like falling a foot or two. Although here we have another one. Another man reportedly left from a window yelling, look, everyone, I'm a dragonfly. And then the men broke. The men broke both legs. But he stood up and continued running. ******* rad. ******* Sigma Sigma behavior. Yeah, absolutely. Now we're adding Sigma but added adding. This is a new kind of man. And the rarity kind of man look, everyone have a dragonfly, breaks both legs, keeps running. Based on the information you've provided us, I can't say he's not a dragonfly. No, he is an absolute, absolute, absolute king. Ohh, good for I I hope you had a great life, yeah. And another one saw his heart escape through his feet and beseeched a doctor to try to put it back into place. Yeah, you don't want to have that happen. That doesn't sound fun, keep you want to keep that somewhere around the middle of your body, someone sprinted down the lane, claiming that he was being chased by bandits with donkey ears at a nearby river. A man was convinced that he was a circus tightrope Walker and attempted to balance his way across the cables of a suspension bridge. It doesn't say. The report does not tell you. Sounds like you did great. Yeah. Like he was right. Yeah. He's not in the death report. Yeah. So he's not in the report. And therefore another another person did try to die in the river. He tried to jump into the river only to be saved by his friends. And he was screaming, I am dead. I am dead. And my head is made of copper and I have snakes in my stomach and they are burning me. Such a weird description of like tripping and saying, like, my head is made of copper. I'm trying to think of like what was going on? What? Like what? What series of events did did he spiral down in his brain to have that sentence? I just, I'm not quite sure. It's it's it's it's definitely, I can definitely see it happening. I just. I just can't. I'm trying to think like what exactly what happened to get to that point. It's real, real interesting. I think some of these are hard because again, it's like these people just think literally think they're going insane. Yeah. Or that like this stuff is just actually happening to them. Like you. Like when you tripping on acid, you already kind of have the feeling that you there is moments where you feel like this is like, this is like never going to end even though you, even though you know, you know you're on acid. These people don't know that, right? Like these people don't have the reassurance like, no, I took acid, I'm on a drug. This is going to be over 8 hours. They think this is going to last forever, right? Like they think this, this is just the world now, like this is just. Some of those, Robert Anton Wilson, who is a thinker I enjoy a lot, writes a lot about how to calm people down when they've taken too much. And most of his advices around talking about like, OK, well, how long ago did you take it? Hey, well, that the good news is that this is going to end here, you know, it's only going to last this long. Like you're through this .0, this is the, this is the second hour freakies. And by the third hour you'll be fine again and enjoying it like it's all about making keeping in people's minds like this is going to pass. So yeah, you're right. Like this is the ******* worst way to take drugs. So local newspapers, and also like in in national newspapers described described this as among the stricken delirium rose. Patients thrash wildly on their beds screaming that red flowers were blossoming from their bodies, people throwing themselves from rooftops, men and women throwing their clothes off and running in the streets naked, and children complaining their stomachs were infested with coils and snakes. Which mean half of that sounds like, yeah, that's like a normal good time just running around the streets naked on acid. Other apps like, yeah, that doesn't seem pleasant with coils and snakes in your stomach, but also like flowers blossoming from your body. I can, I can, I can understand that kind of sensation. But, like it definitely. It definitely wasn't all horrible and night, like, nightmarish. We, we we already mentioned the giddy people with burning anuses, but for like, the full, entrapping folks. According to the New York Times, there was reports of people like hearing heavenly choruses and seeing, you know, bright colors. The world look beautiful to them. Apparently the head of the farming Co-op wrote hundreds of pages of, like, enlightened tripping poetry. You see, like that. That guy must be sick as ****. Is knowing nothing. He starts tripping. Not knowing he's tripping. It's just like time to make some ******* art like you. You know what this head state is good for? Writing some ****. He just, like, went to his cabinets, wrote poetry. That's ******* awesome. That's a guy. I I'll bet he handled just everything that life through it. Well, like that says a lot about you when you're like, oh, demons have infiltrated by brain. Guess I'm going to hang out in my cabin and write some poems. Hundreds of pages. Wow. Like I could have. I could hardly write **** on acid. I cannot imagine trying to write poetry. I've done a lot of creative stuff on assets. Creative stuff, yeah. I just feel like specifically like reading and typing can can be hard at certain points. You know, if you're like coming down, it can be easier. But like as you're really good for like writing, it's good for ideas that you later can flesh out into writing. But yeah, yeah. So unfortunately, you know, because this was, you know, no one was going on. Many people were taken to local asylums in straitjackets and tied onto beds, making things undoubtedly worse for people tripping. One of those things, I can't even be angry at them because they don't know what's going. I know. Like, you have no idea what's going on. Like, the whole, the whole, like every attempted restraint increase the agitation line is like horrifying from the concept of, like, you're tripping you, you you don't know what's going on, and people are tying you down to beds, making you feel like you're even more stuck in this permanent state of delirium. It's just it just is the worst nightmare. Yeah, all of this is horrible. Yeah, the, the, the, the mayor of the town said, like I've seen healthy men and women suddenly become terrorized, ripping their bedsheets, hiding themselves beneath their blankets to escape the hallucinations. So yeah, it's it's if if you if you don't know what's going on pretty, pretty pretty scary. Except for the poetry guy. Good for him. Yeah. Good for him. Yeah. So so. But by the time the effects had subsided for everyone affected, which is around like a few days after the initial report, like nausea, like, you know, not it it didn't affect everyone at the same time. You know some people got dosed later on it. It's unclear what what exactly because this is the 50s. We didn't have a great idea of the exact timeline. Of events of like when the first effects were felt and like how all sort of spaced out. But this whole incident arrest lasted around like a few days for like everyone everyone totaled. It was reported that anywhere between like 300 to 500 people had felt the effects of, you know, around 50 feeling very, very extreme, like open eye, like hallucinations of objects that aren't even there, like, like very extreme hallucinations. And and four people did die in connection to the poisoning that at least four people died. It's again, it's unclear for exact numbers, for a lot of this stuff. An investigation into the Sun outbreak of the madness was promptly underway. Town officials wanted to get to the bottom of this as quickly as possible. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. You would want to figure out what was happening, yeah. And the blame fell onto a single batch of bread. What so among the common denominator among those affected that they all allegedly consumed bread from one specific Baker works he he was accused of using ergot contaminated rye flour, and he was arrested and a temporary imprisoned. Also, a nearby Miller that he got the flower from was also arrested and given some of the blame. The. The funny part is, is that around this time the French government had a very top down grain distribution system that rigidly controlled everything about where the Greens were milled, where they were sent, and what bakers could use which flour. So bakers had no choice in what type of flour to use or what type of grain they could use in baking. It was all decided by other people because France bread is like, it's a real big deal and it's pretty, pretty, pretty important. Yeah. For the record, just like ergot poisoning, there are a lot of cases of like different, like dancing. Manias and whatnot. And like the medieval in medieval Europe were like, whole towns will be, well, everyone will start like, dancing or like, hallucinating. And, you know, they always came down as like, these people assumed apocryphal of stories about like demon possessions or whatnot. And now a lot of the suspicion is like, Oh yeah, some air guide got. No, yeah, it was it was just kind of tripping, poisoning. It seems like one of the rougher trips to go on. It's not super clean. It's no. I mean, I've done LSA, which I think is similar. Mint Mobile offers premium wireless starting at just 15. Bucks a month and now for the plot twist. Nope, there isn't one. Mint Mobile just has premium wireless from 15 bucks a month. 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Rebecca Kelly and I am the host and creator of Southern Freight true crime. There are so many people that just have no idea about some injustices in the world, and if you can give a voice to them, you can create change. To be able to do it within podcasting is just such a gift. I believe it was 18 months after I got on with Spreaker that I was making enough that I could quit my day job. It was incredible. I always feel like an ambassador for speaker, but that's because I'm passionate about podcasting. It's really easy to use. Always tell people I am so not tech. Took me 5 minutes to get comfortable with spreaker, and when I find a new friend that has an incredible show, I want them to make money. I want them to be able to do what I did. Follow your podcasting dreams. Let's break your handle the hosting, creation, distribution, and monetization of your podcast. Go to, that's Get paid to talk about the things you love with spreaker from iheart this fall. On revisionist history, is there anything that we haven't talked about or that I should have asked you or you'd like to add that seems relevant? You should have asked me why I'm missing fingers on my left hand. A story about sacrifice. I think his suffering drove him to try to alleviate suffering. And the shocking discovery I made where I faced the consequences of writing a book I thought would help people? Isn't that funny? It's not funny at all. It's depressing. Very depressing. Religious history is back with more. Listen to revisionist history on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. I've never seen less enthusiasm for a great idea in my life. Similar to our gotten yeah, they're tryptamines that are like really rough. And it's I would not, don't, don't do LSA, no Hawaiian baby woodrose seeds for. If you're going to take LSA, then actually, like, synthesize it. You can. You can synthesize it, which is a felony. But you can just buy Hawaiian baby woodrose seeds and eat them and you will have maybe the worst trip of your life. Great advice from from the pod. Yeah on on on on the on the on the Ryan Urgot topic that the past growing season was especially wet and ergot fungi did grow across the country's rye fields. But the amount of ergot on the rise in the amount of rye used in baking was thought to not be enough to induce any to any type of poisoning. And in fact the the last time or like or got poisoning. Had struck France, was back in, was back in 1816. So almost like a century and 1/2 before this incident and century if it's the 50s, right? A little less than a century. So the last incident was 1816. This was 1918. You said 1860. You got, you got you. So essentially and 1/2 ago and no other towns any and no other part of France was affected by anything similar to this. So the ergot thing is kind of iffy. But the explanation was the only thing that doctors investigators could come to would do. Like, you know, they're they're limited knowledge around brain altering substances and just pressure from town officials to get to the bottom of this so that they had something to blame and people could like move on. But, you know, as a result, not much evidence really backs up their backs up their got claim and a lot of experts today kind of deem it bunk. Yeah, there's and there's a bunch of, like, there's this thing Kiki on that the Greeks would take. That was like this Greek hallucinatory thing that they think it was because they were putting grain and wine. It might have been air got poisoned, but also, like, people enjoyed it. And so there's a lot of debate over whether or not it could have been our got. But I don't know. I don't know what else is. There are other other theories about what it might be if it was over. Oh yes, there is. Oh, boy. Is it the CIA? CIA Garrison? Where can they get to it? Oh yeah, it it doesn't really make much sense that the high amounts of air got Rich would only be in one batch of grains in a single batch of bread from just one bakery and one small town doesn't doesn't really make sense. Other explanations that people have come to includes like mercury poisoning and overuse of other fungicides. These have been mostly disproven. That doesn't seem like mercury poisoning. And as a guy who likes to drink some mercury, you know, Joe Boy, Mark on. So yeah. So there's a lot of other theories around like fungicides being used, but those have been kind of disproved by some people. But others still point to them as possible explanations. But, but there is one other theory that we will focus on that features two of my favorite things, LSD and the 1950s CIA. Because if you're going to pick a CIA, then the 1950s, they had the most fun. They had the most fun. Like, you know who else has a lot of fun? Garrison? Who? Who? And is also the 1950s CIA. Whomst our sponsors. Oh, really? Yeah, could happen here. Is sponsored only by the 50s CIA. Only the one from the 50s. Yeah. When you order any of our project products, they will come to your house and inject you with 7000 hits of LSD. Hey, three. Hey, that is that sounds like a great deal, honestly. You're saving a lot of money. You are saying that that is a lot of free as a lot of acid for the amount of money you're spending. Look, that's life. You you won't do more acid, that's for sure. You're that. That's acid for life. You won't do it again. Yeah, you might. You probably. You won't have to do it. You won't. You won't have to do any expenses ever again. Yeah. You'll you'll survive. You'll just be a very different person by the end of the yeah, you. You won't survive. Your body will. Yes, someone else will be inhabiting it. At the end of that trip, someone else will wake up. So, Speaking of waking up, here is all the products. Conquer your New Year's resolution to be more productive with the Before Breakfast podcast and each bite size, daily episode time management and productivity expert Laura Vanderkam teaches you how to make the most of your time, both at work and at home. These are the practical suggestions you need to get more done with your day. Just as lifting weights keeps our bodies strong as we age, learning new skills is the mental equivalent of pumping iron. Listen to before breakfast wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, lethal listeners. Tig here. Last season on lethal lit. You might remember I came to Hollow falls on a mission, clearing my aunt Beth's name and making sure justice was finally served. But I hadn't counted on a rash of new murders tearing apart the town. My mission put myself and my friends in danger. Though it wasn't all bad. I'm going to be real with you. Like? I like you, but now all signs point to a new serial killer in Hollow Falls. If this game is just starting, you better believe I'm going to win. I'm Tig Torres and this is lethal lit. Catch up on season one of the hit Murder Mystery podcast, Lethal Lit, a tig Torres mystery out now and then TuneIn for all new thrills in Season 2, dropping weekly starting February 9. Subscribe now to never miss an episode. Listen to lethal lit on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. When PT Barnum's Great American Museum burned to the ground in 1865, what rose from its ashes would change the world. Welcome to grim and mild presents an ongoing journey into the strange, the unusual, and the fascinating. For our inaugural season, we'll be giving you a backstage tour of the Always complex and often misunderstood cultural artifact that is the American sideshow. So come along as we visit the shadowy corners of the stage and learn about the people who are at the center of it. In a place where spectacle was king, we will soon discover there's always more to the story than meets the eye, so step right up and get in line. Listen to grim and male presents now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Learn more over at grim and So, 1950s CIA wild time, great time. In 2009, Hank P Albarelli is an American writer and journalist released a book called a Terrible Mistake, which focuses on the suspicious death of a CIA scientist named Frank Olson who worked on the CIA mind control experiments during the late 40s and early 50s. While researching the book, Albarelli claims to have come across a number of old CIA and White House documents referencing the Pont St Esprit incident. And he claims that the village was the target of a CIA experiment on the mass effects of LSD and that around the time that Frank Olson wanted to sever his ties with the Army and CIA, Frank started talking about his participation in the experiment, which may have led to the government offering Olson. So I I know that is a lot and it is slightly more than just a speculation. We're going to get into the evidence here shortly, but by now it's pretty well known that throughout the authorities. Season 60s, both the US Army and the CA. I tried to use hallucinogenic hallucinogenic drugs such as LSD as both an offensive weapon and as a way to make like psychic super soldiers in the programs like MK Ultra, MK Naomi Project, Bluebird Project Artichoke, what lots of these bird watching, lots of these things. We're trying to find different ways of using LSD for, like offensive and defensive means. Some of the interest was promoted by was was prompted by reports of the Soviet Union doing experiments with drugs at the same time also stuff around like you know like like like psychic powers and and hypnosis. Well this was very popular around this time for for lots of different intelligence agencies. But so Albarelli uncovered a report from 1949 by the director of the Edwood Arsenal which many which which was where many U.S. government LSD experiments were carried out and this report stated that the. Are we should do everything, everything is possible, everything. Everything possible to launch so-called field experiments using this drug and later in his 2009 book, Alberelli claims he found references to a government document with the label Re Pont, St Esprit and F Olson Files. SO span Slash France, operation file inclusive, Olson Intel files hand carry tabellen. Tell him to see to it that these are buried. This document does exist like we we we like we we we we we do have this label. So on on this document but like the actual contents of the document are are gone by this is this is this is this is just a label that is being referenced as you know there was a thing with this title. So the document label references Frank Olson and David Bellin. Bellin was the executive director of the Rockefeller Commission created by the White House in the mid 70s to investigate abuses carried out worldwide by the Central Intelligence Agency. So Albarelli believes that the that the French town. The incident, which is like the the the Pont St Esprit, which is the name of the town, and the Athelstan files mentioned in the document, would definitely show that if the document hadn't been buried, as it was said in the in the label the CIA, it would show that the CIA was experimenting on the townspeople by dosing them with what he thinks was LSD. Now there is also a bit more to it than that. Using foias, he got a hold of another CIA document, A2 page report from 1954, detailing a conversation between a CIA agent and a representative of the Sandoz. Chemical company. So the this, the Sandoz base was the place where Albert Hoffman invented LSD in 1938. And it was, it was, it was only a few 100 kilometers away from Pont St Esprit, the town where this happened. So the, the, the, the chemical company was actually pretty, pretty close relatively to like Europe. And it was also the only place where LSD was being made at the time. And they were providing both the army and the CIA with a lot of, a lot of acid between. They're also giving it, like, they're also giving it to universities. They gave lots to Timothy Leary initially. They sure did. They were, they were. They give quite a lot to Tim Leary. They were, they were giving a good out to a lot of different universities and research people, but including the US government. So the CIA, the CIA agent wrote in this report that was like he was detailing a dinner he had with this representative of the chemical company and he reported that after having several drinks the scientists started talking about the Pont St Esprit incident. The sandals official burned out the Pont St Esprit secret was that it was not the brunt. All continued the sandals official for weeks. The French tied up our laboratories with analysis of the bread. It was not the grain ergot, it was a diethyl laminate. Sorry, it's. The last part of the LSD. Yeah. Diethyl acid. Yeah. The the diethylamide like compound. So yeah the surgic diethyl acid is what LSD stands for. So yeah he the the the scientist said that it was it was like it was like basically an LSD like compound. So that's that was the that was report to detail like a dinner that a CIA agent had with this scientist. And that document was uncovered. That was it was from, like, the 50s. Now this, this, this next part has a little bit less proof to it because there's no documents backing this up. But Albarelli also claims that Derek is digging. Two former CIA researchers reached out to him and revealed that revealed some details of some possible details of the method of the poisoning. They told him that the village was subjected to an air blitz of pulverized LSD. Holy ****. Said Bob them. I'm sorry, that's ******* based, so. To force the test people into taking the substance through the air. According to the researchers, this manner of of this manner of distribution proved mostly unsuccessful, forcing the CIA to move on to phase two, which was contaminating local food. So apparently the air if the if the if the Air Blitz was a thing, it didn't work super well. Bummer. Yeah, I know. Although actually we will talk about to have Sophie bias a plane. We will talk about this later, but the CIA did do more air blitzing of of acid in New York City. Actually, they would ride around in cars in like poorer and poorer, more like multicultural areas shooting LSD out of the back of the car to see what would happen to people. I mean take out the racism and that really is a dream job just driving around cities. Air dosing people with acid at random, smoking cigarettes, probably. Oh my God. So with the conclusion drawn that it was one of the town's bakeries being the source of the poisoning, Albarelli says it was possible that LSD was put in or on to the bread. So yeah. And also lots of the scientists, lots of the scientists dispatched to investigate the poisoning after took place were actually from the Sandoz chemical company. They studied the situation for like two or three weeks and gave the explanation that would later be kind of disproven that it was ergot poisoning which they they told to town officials and the British Medical Journal. What, what, what no one knew at the time was that one, the existence of LSD in the 1st place and two, that Sandoz was the company making it and giving these drugs to the US Army and to the CIA. And apparently Albert, apparently Albert Hoffman himself went to the town to investigate this incident. So yeah, and one last thing on like the physical evidence side of things, albarelli also found an undated White House document that appeared to be part of a larger file that had been sent to members of the Rockefeller Commission containing the names of two French nationals who had been secretly employed by the CIA and made direct references to the quote Pont St Esprit incident. Also, it was linked to the document linked former CIA biological warfare expert and the chief of the Fort Derrick's Special Operations Division. So those are all places that they were experimenting with this similar kind of thing. Yeah, we, we we we have mentioned the Rockefeller Commission a few Times Now. If you remember the names, Frank Olson, the guy, the one of the CIA researchers on LSD, and David Bellin, they were on the label of that missing document. So but Bellin was the executive director of the White House Commission to investigate the CIA's abuses and crimes, which was called the Rockefeller Commission. It was formed by President Ford in 1975 to investigate abuses and other activities. The CIA and a few other intelligence agencies that were operating within the states. So the Rockefeller Commission revealed not only like the reason why we know about MK Ultra was because the Rockefeller Commission, this is, this is how we know this was a thing. So it not only revealed stuff about like programs around MK ULTRA, but it also revealed the details of the CIA dosing their own scientist Frank Olson with LSD and possibly killing him. There's also like, there's like a Netflix series about this called Woodward, which I haven't. I haven't actually watched yet, so I don't know how good or accurate. Is, but they did. They did make a Series A few years ago about the death of Frank Wilson and all of the weird sketchy stuff surrounding both his job and and and and and his death. Do you love the CIA folks? Uh-huh. So the the Commission also concluded that the head of the CIA's LSD program, doctor Sidney Gottlieb, destroyed all of the drug programs records in 1973 to hide the details of possibly illegal actions, and he was personally involved in the torture of Frank Olson. 20 years after Mr Olsen's death, and 10 years after the last experiments were halted, Dr Gottlieb ordered the destruction of all the records of the program, including a total of 150. Two separate files. This came shortly after other reports that that that records were being destroyed by Richard Helms. The the the the then director of Central Intelligence. So it's undoubtedly true that the CIA was up to up to some **** involving LSD around around the exact time period of this French town incident. Yeah, you're certainly not like you're not coming out of nowhere suggesting the CIA may have dosed all these people. No, but they did it to a bunch of folks if they didn't do it. Here they've done similar **** and it's also. It's also worth mentioning at this point that like. This is like the point where the CIA is also running this, like, enormous heroin network out of France as like, if it basically had this, they have this deal with the French where they're like, OK, so the French mob can, like, basically move all the heroin they want. In exchange, they'll, like, stop the communist from taking control of the point of Marseilles. And so this is, this is all also going on, like, at the same time that they're doing the LSD stuff. It's great. Yeah. So there's there's some historians that think the LSD theory does not hold enough water. Steven Kaplan is a US historian. Specializing in the French food history and the author of the 2008 book Cursed Bread, which follows this incident, he says that he is a I've numerous objections to this poultry evidence that this that this against the CIA. First of all, it's clinically incoherent. LSD takes effect in just a few hours, whereas the inhabitants where the inhabitants showed symptoms only after 36 hours or more. Furthermore, LED does not cause the the digestive elements or the vegetative effects described by the townspeople. And so both of those claims I say they're not necessarily. Through it's, it's it's unclear how soon the delirious effects took place. For some people they were they first effect felt. So the whole thing about like the effects only taking effect after 36 hours, that's not that's not necessarily true. And also LSD can definitely have nauseating or digestive effects. Yeah, absolutely. So that's that's that's not that's yeah and and but. But like there were other types of symptoms that are not common for what we think of as like modern LSD. Again, this is the 1950s and we don't know what they were. Actually on it it's maybe not. It may not be what we think of as like LSD now it could be slightly you know this is a whole class of psychoactive drugs that's unclear what they were all actually being dosed with. Who the **** knows what they were being given and who the **** knows what the actual like dose amount was. Yeah we have no idea. It's also you know I think it's leery was the origin of the phrase that like the things that determine what happens on a trip or set setting in dose so your mindset where you take it and who you take it around and the dose and. The fact that these are somewhat unique symptoms could be to the fact that, like other people taking acid have never taken it this way in this town is all dosed at once without knowing what acid is like. Yeah, so. People's other objections revolve around like the delivery system, he says. It's absurd, this idea of transmitting a very toxic drug by putting in, by putting it in the bread As for pulverize, to get for ingestion through the air, that technology wasn't even possible at the time. Most compellingly, why would they choose the town of of Pont St Esprit to conduct these tests? It was half destroyed by the US Army during fighting with the Germans in the Second World War. It makes no sense. And and to that I say that makes it the perfect time for the CIA to **** with. That's yeah, they. Generally would choose to dose someone with acid because it sounded funny like, yeah, like they didn't give it. I think the fact that this town was already kind of like only half inhabited and half destroyed by the by the Second World War, that makes it the perfect town to **** with like. And also they also the CIA and the government very much did have the means to try to distribute stuff via the air because we can see other, we can see other documents are in the time of them doing this to specific areas of of New York City. They also tried to poison the entire New York subway with LSD. In the 50s, but that was shut down by higher ups in in the Central Intelligence Agency. Like God what a time that would have been but but cap but but Kaplan isn't sure or that's the responsible either he says that or combination would not have worked because it doesn't make sense to only one sack of grain would have been affected and he says if it was or got the the effects would have been way more widespread. Yeah that that sounds. He rules out LSD in the grounds of the symptoms that people suffered although similar don't quite fit what we modernly think of as the drug. Also I don't I don't think Kaplan ever taken LSD so I don't think talking about I think he's. Think about it probably not being air got, but I don't think he knows much. Yeah he also. He also. He also points out that LSD probably wouldn't have survived the fierce temperatures of the bakers oven. Although Albarelli counters that it could have been that LSD could have been added after the fact to like the surface of the yeah you could just drop it on. You could just drop it on with like with like liquid blotters. Which also explain how the effects were so different from person to person because one person may be having a whole drop of LSD where somebody may only have like a tiny little like you know, speck of like speck of like like moist liquid or so. I can explain some things, but, you know, this is still pretty much a mystery. You know, it's very clear. It's very much, very well, could have been some kind of hidden LSD CIA experiment or the CIA could have just been, you know, interested in studying what happened in the town since they were also doing studies into psychoactives substances at the time. It could be either or. And that's where it's spooky because you'll never know. Woo. So yes, that is, that is the spooky incident of a French town basically thinking that they lost their minds and then, you know, they eventually see it. Do we? I think it's funny. It is a little funny. It is definitely a little funny. It's it is a great example of like the worst way to trip. Yeah, that that's that's pretty high up there anyway. Critical support to the CIA for dosing random people with acid. Always one of my favorite sets of stories. You you love to see it. So Yep, tune tune in TuneIn tomorrow for more. Spooky spooky story and you can follow these spooky social media that poisons your brain at. Ohh, happened here. Pardon calls on media which yes, Twitter will poison your brain. That is just as spooky. Goodbye. More spooky. Way worse for your brain than surprise. CIA asked it to be honest. The acid wears off. Give us your attention. We need everything you got fast. Waiting on reparations would be the endless podcast TuneIn every Thursday. Politics and word play. We fight for the people because they got us in the worst way. From the hill to Brazil, Bombay to Kanye from the left enclave to what the neocons say every Thursday. Cop the heady conversation and break us off with some bread cause we waiting on reparations. Listen to waiting on reparations on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The art world. It is essentially a money laundering business. The best fakes are still hanging on people's walls. You know, they don't even know or suspect that they're fakes. I'm Alec Baldwin and this is a podcast about deception, greed, and forgery in the art world. I just walked in and saw this bright red painting presuming to be a Rothko. Of course, art forgeries only happen because there's money to be made. A lot of money. I'm listening to how what they're paying for these things. It was an incredible amount of money. You knew the painting was fake. Umm. Listen to art fraud starting February 1st on the iHeartRadio App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. After 30 years, it's time to return to the halls of W Beverly High and hang out at the Peach Pit on the podcast 9021 OMG, visit Jennie Garth and Tori Spelling for a rewatch of the hit series Beverly Hills 90210. From the very beginning we get to tell the fans all of the behind the scenes stories that actually happen so they know what happened on camera, obviously, but we can tell them all the good stuff that happened off camera. Listen. 9021 OMG on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts hello, I'm Erica Kelly from the podcast Southern Fried True crime and if you want to go from podcast fan to podcast host, do what I did and check out spreaker from iheart. I was working in accounting and hating it. Then after just 18 months of podcasting with Speaker, I was able to quit my day job. Follow your podcasting dreams. Let's break your handle the hosting, creation, distribution, and monetization of your podcast. Go to That's If you could completely remove one phrase from your vocabulary, which phrase would you choose? I don't know. Correct answer. No, I meant I don't know which phrase, and the best way to banish I don't know from your life is by cramming your brain full of stuff you should know. Join your host, Josh and Chuck on the Super Popular podcast packed with fascinating discussions on science, history, pop culture and more episodes that ask, was the lost city of Atlantis Real? I don't know. Is birth order important? I don't know. How does pizza work? Well, I do know. Bit about that. See? You can know even more, because stuff you should know has over 1500 immensely interesting episodes for your brain to feast on. So what do you say? I don't want to miss the stuff you should know. Podcast you're learning already. Listen to stuff you should know on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey there, it's Ebony Monet, your co-host for the San Diego Zoo's Amazing Wildlife podcast. In this special episode we're speaking. Doctor Jane Goodall about the fascinating journey that led to her impactful behavioral discoveries on chimpanzees. It wasn't until one of the chimpanzees began to lose his fear of me, but I began to really make discoveries that actually shook the scientific world. Listen to amazing wildlife on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.