A murder case has many layers: the victim, the crime, and the investigation. To truly understand it, you need to dissect each piece of a tragic puzzle. Join Anna-Sigga Nicolazzi and Scott Weinberger every Wednesday for an insider’s perspective, as they reveal to you the Anatomy of Murder.
Wed, 03 Feb 2021 08:00
A 12-year-old girl left home to take a bike ride. Only her bike was found later that day. Days later, the unthinkable was discovered. It became a race against time to get a predator off the street before he struck again.
If you're looking for a new show unlike anything you've ever heard before, check out audio Chuck's latest series killed. Each episode of killed covers a story that you may have never read because it was killed before it got published. I'm Justine Harman, who some of you may know from my show OC swingers, and I'm here to bring these dead stories back to life binge killed right now to get the full story. Hi everyone, Ashley Flowers here and I have exciting news to share. My debut novel, all good people here is officially out now. Our fans are blowing up our social talking about it. You do not want to be left out and the worst thing that could happen is for someone else to spoil it for you because there are some wild twists in this book. If you love true crime content, mysteries, and a grown up Nancy Drew style detective work then I have a good feeling you won't be able to put this book down. So what are you waiting for? Grab your copy of all good people here now, wherever books are sold. Will do is I will give you one piece of information that was not released to the press to know that I was the one that was. What would that one piece of information be? I'm Scott Weinberger's, investigative journalist and former deputy sheriff. Glassie former New York City homicide prosecutor and host of Investigation Discovery's true conviction, and this is anatomy of murder. So today's case took me through some real emotional peaks and valleys. It involves a community which rallied behind a family dealing with the unthinkable at the hands of what I can only describe as pure evil. And just a word of caution. All these cases are difficult to hear for different reasons, but this one involves children and also sexual assault, and for some that might just be too difficult to hear. So just letting you know beforehand, because here we go. The family was Vicki and Ricky Jones, and they are the parents of Cora Jones. The Jones family lived in the countryside of northwest Wisconsin. A pretty tight knit community. I mean, there's a lot of kids and the river runs right through there and they play in the river and had a little store there and it was pretty fun place to be a kid. They had two children. Cord Jones, who was 12, and she had a little brother. If I remember correctly. He was about two years younger than she was. When our kids were small, we had a lot of different animals. You know, in the winter they could have snow forms. They had a lot of stuff to do out here from coral was just a joy to your own. She really wanted to hunt, but she was little uncertain about killing the beer. That would have all come to an end when she saw one. I'm sure she's an excellent shot. Cora was a young girl who, like many young girls, she loved talking on the phone. Now, this is the days before cell phones, but they still had phones and she loved to chat. She loved her friends and talking on the phone and, you know, having kids spend the night. But life had not always been so idyllic and easy for Cora. From the time she was very young, she had some very serious medical conditions. When she was two, she got a really bad kidney infection. Then she got another one called three months later and they found out that she had a bad kidney. She was only three. And then they went in and took one of her kidneys out. So she was in the hospital total of and two big surgeries for a little 3 year old and she was this little tiny girl, this great big bed. She had tubes coming out of her and then to try to sit by her and. To tell her everything was gonna be OK. And she had multiple serious surgeries that basically meant that while they could help her, she had to be on daily medication for the rest of her life. She would never say mom, why me? Never ever she ever feel sorry for herself. Ever. So, as an idyllic of a setting the Jones family lived in, Korea herself did have a recurring fear. The fear of being kidnapped. Now, years earlier, not too far away, a 10 year old girl was kidnapped right off the street. Her name was Ronnie Ishit. It was on August 23rd, 1992 when her body was found about a month later. She was ten, and so was his girl, 10, and Cora watched that on TV. She came home from school zone in the basement. She came down and she goes, mom, what would I ever do if somebody grab me? I mean, she just. Figured something was going to happen to her like that. Let's just go sideways for a minute because there's this interesting theory out there that people talk about, which plays in here, but actually turns it on its head. It's called the third person effect, and basically that when many people view media coverage of various incidents, traumatic incidents, it's very much becomes. It's that person or those people, not me. So people either view the news reports, the media coverage on these horrible traumatic events, one of two ways, either with that third person affect hat on, or like Cora, sometimes over internalizing it. And it really gets into their brain and not only their horror of what happened to that person or people being discussed, but they start to worry about could this be me? She just spat for me to watch him there. It was just, it was her age and she was just so amazed how something like that could happen. It was just unbelievable, you know? She wanted to watch it when she was really small. She loved watching Winnie the Pooh. And it was called too smart for strangers. If it was up to her, we would have watched it every night before she went to sleep. I mean, that's how much she liked watching. And that takes us to the events of Labor Day, September 5th, 1994. While Corey's mom had left work, core had told the grandmother she was just going to take a ride on a bike down to Sanders Bridge, which was just down the road, to go meet a boy that she had recently made friends with. Her brother was at his conference house and coral was at Grandma's house. It was Labor Day and the kids had to go back to school next day and I had to leave. Both had to go back to work on Tuesday. She kept calling from grandma's, all kept calling and calling and then the last time I talked to her was about 2:00 o'clock in the afternoon, and I told her I had to run the work. Now, when she didn't return on time, the family began to get really worried. Cora's grandmother reached out to Cora's mom, and Corey's mom remembers that phone call like it was yesterday. My mother-in-law called and said to my sister-in-law that Clara hasn't been around for a couple hours. Then I cried and went over there and I got to grandma's house. Grandma said that she took the bike. Then Cora went down to the bridge just down the road a little ways because there was a little a 13 year old boy that was fishing down there and they started liking each other. But her mom didn't think much about it other than, uh, where has that girl gotten off to? And as soon as she got to the grandmother's house, all she could think about is I got to go get Rick. My husband, Cory's father. I mean, my husband was on our hunting land, so all I could think about was getting Rick up there because I thought, well, he'll find her. Vicki came and got me when I was going on and my first thought was that she had gotten on an inner tube and pulled it down the river like kids always do, so they did have a starting point. They knew she was meeting this young boy Sanders Bridge, so the search area really was the blocks in the streets around where the bridge was. Our nephew went to look for Clara and him and his girlfriend from the bike laying in the middle of the road. Cora would never, ever just leave her bike lane in the road. And that began an incredible effort, a FamilySearch which included cousins, neighbors, and that grew and grew throughout the hours of their search in the area. She was in the corn field. I mean, you know, we were hoping it was something like that, but I think down deep we knew it wasn't. Back now to the disappearance 2 years before of young Ronel. Because when now Cora's family heard this, obviously there's going to be flares going up because they found her bike. But no, Cora. But Runnel 2 years before when she disappeared, one, it was only 45 miles away and secondly when Marnell was kidnapped, she was riding her bike. So now Coors parents knew this was the time to reach out to police, and that would be the Waupaca Sheriff's Department, and investigators quickly arrived and began working the case. In one sense we were lucky because the first officer on the scene knew us personally and nicora, so they immediately took it as trouble. And that's kind of unusual. Usually the first thing you think that somebody ran away or. Cora was last seen wearing pink shorts, a pink top and a fluorescent green jacket. That's not the kind of items that would be difficult to find in an all out search. They said they didn't want the family to help search, but, well, guess what? We searched until dark. There was just tons of people there. I think from that point on, she became everybody's little girl. I have to tell you how to seek my first thoughts here was an abduction bicycle on the road? No. Young girl? Yeah. And by that time, what time it got dark, didn't find anything. But they did not stop searching. Go home. You can't sleep if you look at your close your eyes and sleep that you're giving up on her and it was just a guilty feeling. And it was much more than just coarse family searching. I mean, at this point they have searched parties of up to 100 people to the point that it was almost difficult to manage. To be dark and they told us we had to leave. How do you leave and not know where she was? That was probably the worst thing that ever could happen to us and we had to get in our cars and drive away. Police didn't want Rick to cooperate with the search, and that's very often how it is. And they're trying to protect the investigation. They don't know where this is going to go. They want to make sure that if there's anything of evidentiary value or if there's any trouble encountered along the way, that it isn't going to be the family. That is though, anyone to find it or to potentially be accused of contaminating the scene. And so that's where their head is. But obviously Rick, the father, he couldn't stop himself from looking. It's not a good feeling and. It was hard to rest, so I'd go out with one group and come back in. I'd change my shirt in my hat and go out with a different group, but I don't want anybody trying to stop me. I don't know how you feel about it, but, I mean, I'm the prosecutor, right? And yet I totally get it that he cannot be sitting home while his daughter is missing. He needs to be out there searching. And I think for myself, if it's any family member or friend, I would have a tough time following that directive too. Yet from the other side, the law enforcement, prosecutors perspective, that's the directive I'm giving. But I get it both ways, you know, and a secret for families. It's always the search for a loved one. It's that way for law enforcement, too. But it's also a rescue and recovery mission. Until it's not. You know, governor eats provider, any resource we needed even sent his helicopter up. I was up in helicopter flying around with him. That shows the incredible amount of cooperation between the family and law enforcement trying to look for Cora and anesthesia. As you know, there was more than just her being missing. Time was not on her side. Whether you are in a small town or a big city, people do band together and it really brought out the best of everyone here. And I think I remember that we the most is just so many people because our little area, nothing like that ever happens around here. They just didn't enough to do with everybody. And there was so many people and companies bringing food and there was just trucks backed up to the door to the spring and then food and it's just unbelievable. The community reacted by embracing this family. Volunteers were sending in food to feed this search party. Which was now up over 100 people. You have Rick out there changing clothes, you have strangers. They're all out there for one reason and one reason alone. That is to try to find this little girl's family, was told by law enforcement, the longer time goes, the more concerns are being raised about her well-being not only from the situation and potentially being abducted, but as we mentioned earlier, she was on daily medication. This was life saving medication. That she needed and that was the extra pressure on everybody to find Cora. But by about that time, I think we were kind of realizing that she was gone. Just hope for the best and get ready for the worst. And beyond the physical search, they stepped it up by using what we so often see on TV, which is the media. Well, then when the media got ahold of it, it was just unbelievable. Vicky, that was her job. She wasn't out doing the search, but her job was to stay there, managing and manning the mic, so to speak. I never thought I could do something like that, but when something like that happens, all I could think about was to try to find her. I don't think we ate her. We need sleeping and eating anything. In those six days, every moment she could get on air to ask people to help to find her little girl, they tried to make sure it was on every major news outlet that maybe someone would have seen something, could say something. It was the top story every day. They kept telling us to try to have a story every day to try to keep coral and the first thing of the news because that's what everybody would see. Advertisement was coming up and you know Scott, looking at your former journalist days, how vital is it for in a case like this, for it to remain the lead story? I see it important and beneficial on 2 fronts and here's why this is an active search. The more people that know she's missing. Even outside of the local community, the better. Having the family make the plea is really a way to step up the amount of coverage and the potential the story could be picked up statewide or even nationally. Now on the investigative side, I've COVID cases where someone was just driving through the community or visiting on the day that someone went missing, only to realize that they may have important information after seeing the story later on on the news back when they get home. There was a big plane crash that was taking her out of the top story, so our governor was Tommy Thompson at the time. Invited us to come down to Madison on a Sunday, so they figured that was going to put her back up to the top story. There were so many TV cameras around. I was really concerned that I didn't want too much information. I wanted them to spend their time trying to find her. Them wearing sort of two hats here, right? I mean, clearly former member of law enforcement and clearly a journalist whose responsibility is to get information out to the public. But I think it's a delicate balance to be able to make sure that messages were getting out without giving out too much material that could affect a trial down the road. And that is why I think on all fronts, law enforcement and prosecutors alike, this is exactly the type of case that you not only are OK with media. Mention you're welcome it. Hopefully this is a search and rescue and you'll always have to bet on the person being a survivor. You need to get it out there because it is all hands on deck to try to, in this case, find a missing child. So Cora goes missing on a Monday, and that following Saturday at 8:00 o'clock at night, Cora was featured on the National Show, America's Most Wanted. That show years ago, then they show the kids were kidnapped. So in the middle of the week I talked to somebody from Altair. We had one video that we went to Disney with her to Florida in March. And I said I'll send it and make sure you take care of look at those only video we had her. So we came home that night early so we could watch that and then at the end of the show she was on there after America's Most Wanted. Rick and Vicki are sitting there their home. They now hear cars pull up in front of their door. We're seeing two cop cars driving the driveway so we knew something will happen. Read it. Is their daughter with them? Did this show bring them the news they were hoping? Did it give them the answer, or did it bring them back their little girl? But what are you seeing? Two of our ministers walking in front of the cops. We knew what they were going to tell us. Five days after her disappearance and about 70 miles away from where her bike was found, 2 hunters were walking alongside the road and they notice down a ditch. A body of a young girl. It was pretty sad, but it was like a big weight had been lifted off my shoulders. It was now I knew I wasn't letting her down. I have to break in here for a moment because I don't want anyone kind of turning their head sideways when they hear Rick saying that he felt some relief getting this news. Because, you know, I always feel so protective of the victim's family because there is no one-size-fits-all for how people feel. But just think about what he's really saying for a second. Of course, this is the very worst news he could ever hear. I'm sure it was the very worst feeling imaginable in the world, but at that moment he knew that there was nobody hurting his little girl. Anymore. And isn't that the thing that would give any parent, any human, any person, some sense of relief? Detective Ben Baker would be the detective who would go to the scene and start processing it as a crime scene. He found the body of a young female naked, her hands bound behind her back. And the bind used. Was a cut off piece of a pink T-shirt and a black strap around her neck and it appeared that there had been a sexual assault. I think they would have given us any information we asked for. They all say they think they found her because they can't be sure to others not autopsy. Our dentists came gamer and dental record and I asked them if they could see the scar on her from the kidney surgery and they said they thought they could. During the autopsy they discovered that she had some bruising to parts of her body. Cause of death would be from the multiple stab wounds they found. But right away they started to look at similarities, similarities between how Cora was found and now, going back again to two years before to Ronelle's case, both young girls, both riding bikes, relatively alone. Discarded in the woods. And even though there are two years apart, what other abductions could be related? A sexual predator normally doesn't stop until they're caught or they die. For law enforcement, this is a sign that these cases could be connected, and there could be more. Wanted to look at whether these were connected. They started to tug on that rope and they found out another. In July, 2 months before Cora was abducted, a woman had called the police. There's a State Park to take 10 miles away from rural she'd been riding her bike. A man asked her for directions. He drove away, but then he came back and he hit her with his car. She fell into a ditch. The man got out and he approached her with a gun, and it was only when another car approached that this guy, the guy with the gun fled. From the drive by and he got scared and jumped in his car and drove away. So she got away and I guess we should took more and more of a warning from that, but hindsight's 2020, it turned out she was an adult, but she looked very young. This woman was 24 years old and this assault police suspect that the victim was approached from behind and the fact that her hair was back in a ponytail. The assailant may have thought she was a lot younger than she actually was. She eventually came up with a good enough description. They got a good illustration of him, she said. He was in his 50s, had a scruffy mustache, not a lot of hair, and her description was detailed enough that they were able to come up with a composite sketch. They had to be careful about releasing these illustrations and stuff. It was almost like a lynch mob mentality, and I was afraid that there was going to be. Two or three people coming in and saying, hey, we hung the guy, you know, I was always afraid somebody was wrong, was going to get hurt. A living witness. Anesthesia, as you know, is such a valuable piece of intelligence is to be able to describe, you know, the method of approach of what the person said, what they look like, what they were driving. I mean, this is critical information that could connect these two cases. Most importantly, she was able to describe his car going back to about the 80s or the 90s. It was a maroon sedan. They brought all these computers and they put all the tips in the computers and it kept kicking out a maroon car and Ben Baker said, we find that guy and we found courage killer. Police are looking for anyone that can give them assistance. They're going to other precincts to compare other cases to see if there are other rapists, kidnappers, murderers in the area that just might fit some sort of a match. We told everybody, anything you can think of, call it in. There might be something that's connected that we don't realize is connected. You had an attempted assault and you had a homicide, and police were anxious in Appleton to share their information with Waupaca and when they. With the Appleton Police Department, they learned that there had been a recent string of burglaries, sexual assaults, and the description of the perpetrator in that cases matches their sketch and one more detail. He drove a motor car. So at this point, police knew there was a race against time to find the person responsible for Cory Jones's murder. On November 14th, 1994, more than two months after her murder, police officers responded to a report of a peeping Tom in the nearby town of Appleton. When police arrived the homeowner. Had a 50 year old man in a headlock after he caught him watching his wife through the window. The man being held for police was David Spanbauer and his criminal history would answer so many unanswered questions. So two things to note about this guy who's now just been arrested as a peeping Tom. This David Spanbauer won in his 50s. Scruffy mustache, not a lot of hair, and what does he drive? I'm a rude car, but now let's go back in time and look at his record a little bit. While you can't use that in court because that will be propensity, because someone has committed a crime in the past doesn't mean they committed this one. You have to prove each crime based on the evidence in and of itself. But when we look at this guy. As far back as 1959, after being dishonorably discharged from the Navy, he had been in and out of prison. In prison two times before he broke into the house and raped the babysitter, and then when the family came home, he shot the homeowner in the face of the shotgun. He obviously had no regard for human life whatsoever. Are looking at this and right away they're honing in. They just might have got their man. So when police brought spanbauer in and began to ask him questions about incidents within the area, Spanbauer was very upfront and willing to discuss his alleged crimes. The following will be a recorded statement from Mr. David Spanbauer on Monday, November 21st, 1994. We have the interview with David Spanbauer and you'll hear portions of it. And just one thing to note, you know, people sometimes talk about sound quality of these things, but these are the actual real audios being taken for evidentiary purposes. So they may not sound as high quality as when you're recording a podcast, for example, but that is because if they're less than ideal, it is real time as the evidence is unfolding and that is what you're getting the peak into. Are you responsible for any homicides in the city? Yes. And of his statement to police, the most detail was given in a back and forth with the detective, Detective Baker, about Cora Jones. When did you first see her? Bicycle. I pulled over and told her to get in the car she got. Items. This. Because. He made her get out. She was bound. Walked her down into a ditch. Could you? Show me where where the stab wounds were. Chest, stomach area, chest and stomach area, OK? He told investigators that he tore apart of her shirt. And used it to tie her hands. And despite attempts to strangle her, she fought back. Which is heartbreaking. How did this one? Wanted to recognize. I'm just gonna say this is as many interviews that we've done with suspects or with victims or families of victims. These confessions never get easy. I think it's fair to say, you know, having been involved and heard countless of these at this point it just. It always stops me in my tracks because we're talking about people. While yes, it's for evidence and you're building cases, he's talking about a young girl in this case, and he's talking about other victims too, and I've never been able to wrap my head around that. And I know Scott, you and and just so many others, probably everyone out there listening to this feels the same. That you know how people are capable and you listen to him. It is so matter of fact. And that is the thing that probably always hurts me the most. You know, he took everything from Cora, her life and all her love, from her family. But for him, it's just matter of fact. Here's what I did. What do you want to ask me next? When did you decide she had to die? You know, hearing Detective Baker ask him, when did you decide you had to kill her? Because remember, he hadn't killed many of his other victims before and hearing this guy say. As soon as he saw her. It just, it added a different level of, you know, that you feel in your stomach because it's just so happenstance. You know, he had blindfolded some of his victims. He hadn't worried about whether he would be seen, but to him, he didn't want to go back to jail. And the easy fix for that to him was to take this 12 year old's life. Well, he had been in prison two times before, and if he was originally served half of his first sentence. He would have still been in prison and we still have our girls. But they just kept letting them out early. You're Scott talking about this statement a bit because so many people always say, well, why do people talk to the police, I think. Somebody like Spanbauer gets to the end of the road and realizes it is the end of the road for him. And justice really, in a sense, thinks maybe there's somebody somewhere that will understand his way of thinking or will forgive his actions. And if there's a higher power that does that, then that's what it is. But I think at a certain point there's a lot of people within his position that do want to. Get it off their chest and do want to be able to feel like the end of the road is there for them and they no longer have to run. I think it's just that, as you said, Scott, it's the end of the road, but so he's just kind of like, all right, I'll tell you what you want to know. But there was so much he wasn't willing to talk about, he didn't want to answer any of the questions about the whys, which to me would go for someone who was looking for forgiveness or was trying to bear their soul. This is a guy who. Cares about nothing and no one to have done the horrific crimes that he did. But he knows he's done. He knows he's going back to prison and this time he's not going to get out so short. You need me to prove it to you? Sure. It really was. I mean, is there a part of him that almost is reliving it at the moment and proud of it and just wanting me to make sure they believe that it's him? Maybe. Is Africa drop one. For investigators, it wasn't the end of the road. They still wanted to dig deeper and make sure that they could confirm that what he was saying was true. So they started to dig into the forensics. So when it comes to actual physical evidence, in my hands I have a copy of the FBI's report which directly connects Spanbauer with Corey Jones's murder. The report talks about specific physical evidence that was located. It talks about vacuum sweepings. It talks about. That black strap that was found near her body, it also talks about the pink strip of cloth that was used to bind her hands. That was a direct forensic connection to spanbauer. I mean, they had him not only through a confession and a Sega, but they had him with solid forensic evidence. And you always want that. There is no such thing as too much evidence. And, you know, someone might say, well, he's already confessed. Well, I can't tell you how many times I've gone into the courtroom. And now that confession, while the defendant is trying to take it back, they are recanting it. They're saying that, well, the police told me what to say, or they made me say it, or I just made it up. And while in my experience that is most often not true, we do know those things have happened, and a jury knows that too. And so you want to protect against that, to show that, well, we have matched up what this person says, specifically some of the things that were never released to the media, which is exactly what, by the way, Detective Baker did during this interview. He made sure to get details. Spanbauer asked him questions about things that had never been released. And that is so important because the jury needs to be, and they should be absolutely sure that not only is this the person who's saying they committed the crime, but it actually is the person who is. But let's talk about the way that the family found out and what they were told about the arrest. I was at work and I came back on my lunch break and the office girl was standing outside by the back door and she said, I just want you to know they think they might have found the guy that killed coral. So that's how I found out. So then of course some of the media that we got to know personally knew where I worked. So then they started calling me to see if I could do an interview at work so they could get it on TV later that afternoon. A guy in prison in Minnesota that confessed to it, and how sure are you, you know, how positive are you going with this guy? And so now, while everyone's gearing up for a trial and getting very ready, the case ultimately did not go to trial. David Spanbauer pled guilty. And we could have a trial if we wanted one, but there was no sense in it. All we wanted was off the street so we couldn't hurt anybody anymore. As part of his plea deal, he admitted to much more than Cora Jones homicide. He admitted also to the murder of Renel and many other crimes as well. The first time we went to court was first. 13th birthday was first time we ever seen it. I couldn't even imagine what it was going to be like to see him, but it was horrible to even look at him, thinking what he did was horrible. We got close to it. Before he was sentenced to, family members were given the opportunity to give their victim impact statements to tell this man in the courtroom and more importantly, the public and the judge who was just about to send sentence everything that this man had ripped from their lives. Ripped my shirt down and wrote down what we wanted to say and rip during his sentencing got to say well, how we felt, so that was good. Some of my family and our our family talked, put them away forever because he could never hurt anybody again and and I think just trying to get through to his head what he did to these girls. And we just. Wanted them to feel a little guilty, but it was nothing. He didn't think he did anything wrong. The District Attorney said. Even if you're a man at all, just turn around and face your victim's family. Because Rick and I were only a few feet behind him. He wouldn't pick his head up and look at anybody. And the judge after hearing that he sentenced David Spanbauer to three lifetime sentences and 403 years. You know, Anna Seeker, in my brain, I have a space which is designated as pure evil people that we've done stories about people that I've come in contact with in my law enforcement career and as a career as an investigative reporter. And David Spanbauer is absolutely on that top ten list. When the judge sat in Spanbauer, he reserved some harsh words for that defendant. He said I don't know what cesspool and hell you crawled out of, said with. The legislature won't let me send you back there because clearly he would have given him the death penalty, I think. I wrote a letter to him and sent it to him because it just made me feel better because I said I, you know? Hope you never go to sleep again and. And ever have peace and I hope you're conscious. Kills it. I can't even imagine being able to close your eyes, is what I said. How do you even live with yourself? After what you did. David's Spanbauer went to prison. He died in prison at 61 years old in 2002. It's a very strange feeling. Sit back and let out a sigh and well, it's over. And now we pick up the pieces and go on. You know, as a toddler, Cora overcame so many medical challenges, nearly losing her life during a kidney surgery and. While in the back of her mind, the kidnapping of another young girl gave her a reason to be fearful. And even though she needed daily life saving medication, she really loved life, her friends and most importantly. Her family. None of us ever think something that bad is going to happen to you. So I mean, everybody just let their guard down because you really don't ever think it's going to happen to you. We take life for granted. We do every day. We just got up, went to work, our kids went to school. You know, don't know how much you can appreciate what you got until somebody's gone. When I think about Cora Jones, Runell and David Spanbauer's many other victims. The big thing that I come out with is I just wish that we could find a way to protect the choras and the Runnels. From people just like him. TuneIn next Wednesday, when we'll dissect another new case on anatomy of murder. Anatomy of Murder is an audio Chuck original, A Weinberger media and forseti media production summit. David is executive producer.